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Old December 30th, 2009, 12:14   #1
TaktikAirsoft
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Montreal Airsoft club

Hello guys and girls

It seem many of you have the same frustration as I when it come to finding a place to play. You ether play when some organizes a game or you play in a paintball place when they decide to let you.

I had an idea about creating a exclusive club for playing airsoft. This is the general idea. If we can get a group of 50 to 100 players to pay 500$ for exclusive membership it would be possible to rent a building, pay the insurance and all the other related fees for airsoft only place to play. We could also charge to none member a fee for playing.

I have a more detail plan in my head. So if any of you are interested please let me know and vote on the servey if possible.

The 500$ come from the cost in playing in league sports in general.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 12:21   #2
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One thing comes to my mind, are those 500 $ for a life time member ship or has to renew every years, two years or maybe three years ?

I'm interesting though, at least we have a secure place that can play on weekend than hassle playing on weekday and wake up early in the morning go to work while my back still killing me.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 12:27   #3
surebet
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Start by pitching your idea at the 5 à 7 in a few days
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Old December 30th, 2009, 12:33   #4
TaktikAirsoft
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I will available in 2 weeks. I'm off for a business trip. When is the next one after that?

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Start by pitching your idea at the 5 à 7 in a few days
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Old December 30th, 2009, 12:39   #5
surebet
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Whenever it's called I guess, there's nothing stopping you from just making one yourself.

This being said, I don't think you'll find 100 players with guns worth more than 500$ that attend public games, let alone that would have the cash to invest.

Good luck though!
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Old December 30th, 2009, 12:40   #6
TaktikAirsoft
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Well if I look at it from a league point of view it would be 500$ a year. Renting a place setting it up and maintaining it is expensive.

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One thing comes to my mind, are those 500 $ for a life time member ship or has to renew every years, two years or maybe three years ?

I'm interesting though, at least we have a secure place that can play on weekend than hassle playing on weekday and wake up early in the morning go to work while my back still killing me.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 13:42   #7
Brian McIlmoyle
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The Numbers

OK.. reality Check

Minimum cost for warehouse space $10/ year a square foot ( good luck finding it but it may be out there)

Minimum playable space = 5000 square foot - Rent = 50 000 / year
Heat and Hydro Minimum $500 a month = $6000
Start up costs - to build a playable environment = $5000
Insurance - $4000

Total year 1 costs = $65000 / $500 per member = 130 members Just to break even

you would need to find about 150 people willing to pony up $500 to become members AND GET THEIR MONEY before proceeding

Balance this against the typical Game cost of $20 per session People would need to be very active players to get their Monies worth .. 25 sessions in a year .. considering most players typically play about 6 to 10 times a year and at that level are considered "Active" players

you need to find 150 "hyper active" players willing to front $500 .. and commit to do it for 3 to 5 years ( because you will likely need to sign a lease )

in addition you will need to incorporate a company to hold this enterprise ( unless you want to take on the $150 000.00 nut that would be represented by the lease obligation )

it's a great idea .. but the reality is fraught with financial risk
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Old December 30th, 2009, 13:52   #8
TaktikAirsoft
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Thank you for your REALITY CHECK.

This is need to make the idea a more realistic one.

Do you have any suggestions that could help?

Thanks again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian McIlmoyle View Post
OK.. reality Check

Minimum cost for warehouse space $10/ year a square foot ( good luck finding it but it may be out there)

Minimum playable space = 5000 square foot - Rent = 50 000 / year
Heat and Hydro Minimum $500 a month = $6000
Start up costs - to build a playable environment = $5000
Insurance - $4000

Total year 1 costs = $65000 / $500 per member = 130 members Just to break even

you would need to find about 150 people willing to pony up $500 to become members AND GET THEIR MONEY before proceeding

Balance this against the typical Game cost of $20 per session People would need to be very active players to get their Monies worth .. 25 sessions in a year .. considering most players typically play about 6 to 10 times a year and at that level are considered "Active" players

you need to find 150 "hyper active" players willing to front $500 .. and commit to do it for 3 to 5 years ( because you will likely need to sign a lease )

in addition you will need to incorporate a company to hold this enterprise ( unless you want to take on the $150 000.00 nut that would be represented by the lease obligation )

it's a great idea .. but the reality is fraught with financial risk
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Old December 30th, 2009, 13:55   #9
surebet
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Start small, rent occasionally spaces using the argument that there is no paint to muck up the place, slowly move towards securing a solid base of players.

The reality of it is I'm not sure people will want to buy you a building.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 14:07   #10
Brian McIlmoyle
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Yes... Mutiple Use Facility

get another group that also needs space but can't afford it and combine your membership.

your play environment needs to be portable .. with no or limited permanent structures

and you will need to clean up after yourself after each event.

Warehouse space is perfectly suited for the use of a practice / training space for Circus performers .. in Montreal there are loads of wannabee Cirque de Solei people .. hook into that community ..

you may want to use the space for AS 2 max 3 times a week .. which leaves a lot of time for other uses

Also ... if you get a space with high enough ceilings .. climbing gyms also lend themselves to multiple use space..

so you build a "co-operative" 3 partners .. a Circus group, a Climbing Gym , and an AS club .. split the time 3 ways .. so now you are on the hook for 1/3 the cost .. finding 40 to 50 people who want to be members would be way more likely than 150

be warned.. Climbers are arrogant jerks, and Circus people are flakey .. be sure you have a solid relationship on paper before proceeding



Quote:
Originally Posted by moogy View Post
Thank you for your REALITY CHECK.

This is need to make the idea a more realistic one.

Do you have any suggestions that could help?

Thanks again.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 14:20   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian McIlmoyle View Post
be warned.. Climbers are arrogant jerks, and Circus people are flakey .. be sure you have a solid relationship on paper before proceeding
Hahaha

And airsoft players are cheap.

I think it's easyer to rent land than building. But we do need a proper indoor CQB building.

There is a lot of industrial and comercial building for rent or sale in the Mtl region. Finding the proper one at the right place is an acheavement in itself. I'd probably ask for an agent for help.


If you have a portable systeme to make CQB killhouse, a simple gym would suffice.

I'm thinking light structures made of poles and heavy plastic tarps to make the walls. That could fit in a small cube truck for transport.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 14:29   #12
Brian McIlmoyle
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That goes without saying...


I've been using a portable wall system at TTAC3 for 4 years .. it's simple and effective ..

made of sheets of Chipboard.. link them together in 3 fold units standing on their end and you can then combine the units to form endless variety of hallways , rooms and structures ..

add some cut outs for windows.. a few free standing door units and you can build pretty much anything ..

the walls are linked together with nylon wire ties .. which are cheap and strong enough ..

If you build a couple of 2 story structures in the corners .. that are fixed .. and combine with the reconfigurable wall system .. the set up can change every game so you can keep it fresh.

Transport is not an issue because you won't be moving ...

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Hahaha

And airsoft players are cheap.

I think it's easyer to rent land than building. But we do need a proper indoor CQB building.

There is a lot of industrial and comercial building for rent or sale in the Mtl region. Finding the proper one at the right place is an acheavement in itself. I'd probably ask for an agent for help.


If you have a portable systeme to make CQB killhouse, a simple gym would suffice.

I'm thinking light structures made of poles and heavy plastic tarps to make the walls. That could fit in a small cube truck for transport.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 14:38   #13
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find a dance studio that will rent you their space (if its big enough) a few nights a month and that has a space to store your plywood wall system and go from there, make it members only, not open to the public to limit liability.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 15:02   #14
FOX_111
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Danse studio often have large mirror walls... Definatly something I"d avoid.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 15:08   #15
pusangani
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ahh true true, maybe a dojo or something then, less mirrors hopefully.

them tae-kwon-do places are prolly struggling these days and could use the extra cash
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