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Old May 23rd, 2009, 17:11   #1
curlex
 
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Question Green Gas and HFC 134a

To whoever reads this,

I was looknig to buy a KJW Hi Capa (propane version), but I dont want to buy propane (could explode; did happen TWICE at a barbeque party I went to). Could HFC 134a be an alternative?
I know that HFC 134a canisters made for airsoft have a different "head" than propane ones, but if i got a propane adaptor on a computer duster can, could that work? If yes, are there any differences between propane and HFC 134a magazine built that could cause HFC 134a to potentially ruin the propane mag?
Also, if this did work, i know that the feet per range capability would change but, will the weight of the Hi Capa (more of the slide is what i am meaning) cause the HFC 134a gas to not be able the pull the slide back and not create "blowback"? If this did happen, I know that the Hi Capa is around 1070g and if I used a lighter one (perhaps the glocks (around 500g) or a berreta ( around 800g)), could that work?
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Old May 23rd, 2009, 17:20   #2
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You can get the duster adapter from Airsoft Innovations, a Canadian company. That way you can just use regular duster cans. And no, HFC 134a will not harm a "propane" mag. The mag can handle either gas. Get the Airsoft Innovations gas gun kit, gives you the propane tank adapter, the duster gas adapter, and some silicon oil for lubrication.
The duster gas might have some issues cycling the slide, but read reviews and see if anyone said anything to be sure if it will or not. I've never used one, let alone with duster, so I can't say. But if it has a metal slide, it might struggle. The lighter the slide the easier it will be for the duster to cycle it.
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Old May 23rd, 2009, 17:21   #3
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Not wanting to use propane in a GBB because it could explode is about as silly as not wanting to ride in a car because it could explode. Sure, if you drive your car off of a cliff, or try to set it on fire while driving: It could. But out of the thousands and thousands of people who own GBB's and are firing propane and green gas (as a brand), I have never heard of one exploding in flames.

But to answer your question; Not likely.

Sure, the weight of the slide has a factor in how weak a gas can push it, and how high the fps is: But what you should be looking at is the recoil spring and blowback unit. Not all guns are able to cycle HFC 134a, even with a plastic slide.

My advice? Man up and use propane.
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Old May 23rd, 2009, 17:23   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShelledPants View Post

My advice? Man up and use propane.
I'm going to agree with him on this. Metal slide + propane, really you have no worries. I've also never heard of this, only with CO2 being used.
What were the guns that "exploded" at the bbq?
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Old May 23rd, 2009, 17:29   #5
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I'm going to agree with him on this. Metal slide + propane, really you have no worries. I've also never heard of this, only with CO2 being used.
What were the guns that "exploded" at the bbq?
I think he means he had propane tanks explode twice at a bbq, and not propane GBBs.
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Old May 23rd, 2009, 17:31   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShelledPants View Post
I think he means he had propane tanks explode twice at a bbq, and not propane GBBs.
Oops, fail by me. Then thats the least of your worries. As long as you aren't an idiot and don't store the propane tank next to open flame or in the sunlight for hours at a time, you're fine. Use common sense about compressed, flammable gas/liquid and it won't blow up.
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Old May 23rd, 2009, 17:39   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShelledPants View Post
Not wanting to use propane in a GBB because it could explode is about as silly as not wanting to ride in a car because it could explode. Sure, if you drive your car off of a cliff, or try to set it on fire while driving: It could. But out of the thousands and thousands of people who own GBB's and are firing propane and green gas (as a brand), I have never heard of one exploding in flames.

But to answer your question; Not likely.

Sure, the weight of the slide has a factor in how weak a gas can push it, and how high the fps is: But what you should be looking at is the recoil spring and blowback unit. Not all guns are able to cycle HFC 134a, even with a plastic slide.

My advice? Man up and use propane.
agreed - if ur gun was designed for propane the 134a gas will just make it laugh at you most likely - stick with propane and it'll serve you well. propane will will only really ignite if u spark or get an open flame in the way...i.e. holding a lighter lit next to ur gun. Common sense really and i've also never heard of 1 incident where a GBB exploded - besides if u checkout 134a i think you'll be pleasantly surprised to find it's also rather flammable so theres not much less of a risk usin it
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Old May 24th, 2009, 05:09   #8
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i think the design for the commercial duster gas has been changed to spray mode.and the adaptor seems too narrow to be fit in.
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Old May 24th, 2009, 11:12   #9
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I've heard that with duster you have to lube more often, I think it's because it dries out the seals faster or something. Also I don't think you can use duster any more because the formula has changed (too many kids sniffing it and getting high) also the added bitterant may have something to do with it.

All in all just go propane. Unless you have a lighted flame right next to where the gas escapes I highly doubt that your GBB will "explode". In fact the most it would do is just light on fire for a second and when the slide slides forward it should cut off the gas. Have you ever done the "fireball" thing with a lighter? The worst that will happen is probably that.
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Old May 24th, 2009, 13:59   #10
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"duster" = HFC-134a = tetrafluoroethane = the correct low pressure gas; what most Japanese GBBs run on.

However, a lot of "air in a can" is actually = HFC-152a = difluoroethane = slightly lower pressure and bad for a number of seals. Don't use it.

The can will always say either tetrafluoroethane or difluoroethane somewhere on it.
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Old May 24th, 2009, 14:43   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantelope View Post
"duster" = HFC-134a = tetrafluoroethane = the correct low pressure gas; what most Japanese GBBs run on.

However, a lot of "air in a can" is actually = HFC-152a = difluoroethane = slightly lower pressure and bad for a number of seals. Don't use it.

The can will always say either tetrafluoroethane or difluoroethane somewhere on it.
+1 to that. You can't find tetrafluoroethance duster "over the counter" anymore. All the stuff you get nowadays is difluoroethance. You have to order the good stuff from industrial supply stores.

And using duster of any kind in a metal slide GBB won't even produce enough pressure to cycle your slide. You'll be left with the equivalent of an underpowered spring gun where you have to manually rack the slide with every shot.
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