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Old December 13th, 2008, 11:54   #1
grantmac
 
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I'm not a newb but....

I figure this is the place for this sort of question:

Where does the CBSA stand on guns that really aren't a replica? I'm spealking mostly about VSR-10 and clones which lets face it, look nothing like any real-steel weapon. The magwell is half-way up the fore-end of the stock and the bolt is just a shiney cylinder.
Aren't these really just BB guns chambered in 6mm?
I'm not condoning or encouraging the smuggling of replicas. I'm talking about legitimate, claimed, no problem if the package is searched ordering from outside the country on these non-replica airsoft toys?

I figure I'm about to get a bunch of opinions, which is fine. Just keep it productive.

Thanks,
Grant
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Old December 13th, 2008, 12:00   #2
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I've heard of a number of 'pellet' looking airsoft guns make it through because as you said, they look like a pellet gun. However of course that hasn't always been the case.
As always its judged on a case to case basis.
When I got my TM VSR I noticed the word 'airsoft' repeatidly printed over the box. I'd bet it would have a better chance of making it through in a blank box.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 13:23   #3
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The dtermination on wheteher a gun is a replica or not is made primarily on the basis of physical appearance. The VSR-10 looks enough like a generic gun, it would be seized based on that alone.

Pellet guns do as well, but they are known to the CBSA to also be capable of serious injury or death, so they do not shoot "harmless" projectiles. This means they can not be replicas.

This is a very watered-down explanation, and it actually is much more complex than that. Most of the determinations are policy driven, and that policy is based on best interpretation of a murky law. Hence the deviations from one agent to another, one agency to another.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 14:48   #4
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best thing to do with these Canadian laws...is to move somewere into a lenient US state were they hold real good airsoft games...lol

whoever makes the laws here are well....not the brightest
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Old December 13th, 2008, 15:19   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcguyver View Post
The dtermination on wheteher a gun is a replica or not is made primarily on the basis of physical appearance. The VSR-10 looks enough like a generic gun, it would be seized based on that alone.

Pellet guns do as well, but they are known to the CBSA to also be capable of serious injury or death, so they do not shoot "harmless" projectiles. This means they can not be replicas.

This is a very watered-down explanation, and it actually is much more complex than that. Most of the determinations are policy driven, and that policy is based on best interpretation of a murky law. Hence the deviations from one agent to another, one agency to another.
Bingo! Mcguyver is on the money, its all about the policy but policy can change and ban any Airsoft gun they want so you never know.

And yes if it looks like a generic gun it will get seized.

Hence why things like the JG Dragons would get through. Its nothing close to a replica it looks like a Super Soaker. Don't get me wrong its TM compatible and you can make it a beast. You can make it a Beast Super Soaker.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 16:04   #6
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The question is who has the burden to prove whether it is a replica of an actual firearm? Because there is no way a VSR looks or functions anything like an actual firearm, and that is the working definition of replica.
I am not encouraging smuggling, but I think that if we exercise the right to legally import everything that we possibly can as private citizens that it will definately help our cause. I am willing to risk blacklisting (I never order across the border anyway) and possibly an appeal to see if this specific gun will be a legal import for anyone.
Grant
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Old December 13th, 2008, 16:08   #7
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If Joe Fuckstick at the Customs office thinks it looks like a real gun, consider it incinerated.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 17:12   #8
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The burden of proof is upon you, not the CBSA. They don't have to justify a seizure, but you have to prove the seizure is unjust or unwarranted in appeals. Only at the time of a CITT appeal do they have to "start" to publicly justify their position.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 17:13   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grantmac View Post
The question is who has the burden to prove whether it is a replica of an actual firearm? Because there is no way a VSR looks or functions anything like an actual firearm, and that is the working definition of replica.
I am not encouraging smuggling, but I think that if we exercise the right to legally import everything that we possibly can as private citizens that it will definately help our cause. I am willing to risk blacklisting (I never order across the border anyway) and possibly an appeal to see if this specific gun will be a legal import for anyone.
Grant
Not saying your arguments are bad but you can write that in your appeal but know that something the size of the rifle like that will put you on the blacklist and every package you get will be opened and taxed.

As an echo to mcguyver the appeal process takes a long time not to mention the opportunity cost lost for you money that could have been put to something else.

As for burden, there is no burden a super soaker looks like a super soaker and a VSR looks like a rifle to an agent.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 17:19   #10
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Originally Posted by cbcsteve View Post
Not saying your arguments are bad but you can write that in your appeal but know that something the size of the rifle like that will put you on the blacklist and every package you get will be opened and taxed.
I wouldnt say always opened and taxed, maybe always opened, but never always taxed.
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Old December 13th, 2008, 17:21   #11
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I wouldnt say always opened and taxed, maybe always opened, but never always taxed.
Oh yes I forgot to mention anything under $20 is not taxed.
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