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Indoor CQB FPS POLL

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View Poll Results: What should the FPS speed be for indoor CQB
300 22 10.28%
320 28 13.08%
330 32 14.95%
350 112 52.34%
Over 350 20 9.35%
Voters: 214. You may not vote on this poll

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Old April 11th, 2008, 04:27   #61
Firewalker
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
Most guns these days newer people are buying have a short life expectancy as it is, and many need to be opened to give them good performance.
Funny, the last time I played against people here in Manitoba, they all had mid to high quality guns. Hell, mine shot 410fps on .2 out of the box.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
I've witnessed a lot of dumb, stupid things at games. Last year a group of us went to alberta for a big game, while there, somebody held a pistol against one of our our guys' skulls and pulled the trigger.

So if the situation allows for a lower fps (no need to worry about range etc), why not?
Wow, so one retard in alberta and the rest of the god damned country suffers. Congrats on the kindergarten punishment mentality. Still have not seen any evidence to prove that 350 is more dangerous than 300 when the proper precautions are made.

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Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
The honus is also on the shooter, and gun owner to use it in a reasonable, responsible manner. In CQB, having a hot gun does not affect skill. So, why? Because some people out there won't spend $10 on a spring, and a few hours learning how to take apart a mechbox. (once you do it the first time, it takes about 20-30 minutes to clean, re-grease, and swap a spring.)
Assumptions are hilarious. You assume everyone is gifted with technical inclination. Not everyone is. Not everyone can take apart a mechbox, let alone put it back together again.

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Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
$70? fps issue aside, who charges $70 for a spring swap? Who pays for that either?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zekk05 View Post
This has nothing to do with inflicting more pain on people. It has to do with the costs involved in toning down a gun to fire at these lowwer rates, in comparison to the costs of mask. 90% of the Manitoba players have guns tuned to the 330-350fps range because thats what our indoor arena has been using for the past 3 years (injury-free as previously stated). To get our guns down to 320fps, we would need to
- buy a new spring (20$)
- have our techs install it (25$ labour)
- have our techs reinstall the old spring upon returning (another 25$)
Versus
- buy a 15$ facemask (which should be mandatory for a business owned field IMO)

So for a player who doesnt know how to swap springs themselves, thats 70$ above and beyond the other costs for attending the game.

On one side, players dont want to spend up to 70$ just to be able to play in one game to play at the lowwer FPS restrictions.
On the other side, players dont want to have to wear a facemask for whatever reasons. A cheap low profile face masl (such as the Sensei) is only 15$!!

70$ vs 15$...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
If it's a TM, it's 280 stock anyways. If it's a clone, you could even accidentally increase the life span.
I love how you think everyone can be technically inclined. It's a laughable concept at best. My TM M16A2 was 310 on .2's, out of the box. So no. It's not that all the time.

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Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
My point isn't about "not having testicles", it's about what's the point? If it was about "having the balls", why doesn't someone just enlist and go over to the sandbox to get shot at with real bullets?
lol. You missed the point. You're crying about FPS limits being too high, when the majority of these guns shoot just under or just over 350 in stock condition. When there's no extra risk involved, why bother changing the spring because someone's got sand in their ovaries?

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Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
I'm not arguing against people who's opinion is that 350 is a good limit for this CQB building (Ultra tight engagements). I'm only asking for a reason other than a) "Grow some balls" or b) "I'm too lazy to change my springs". Other than those two, why would you say is a good reason. (I don't consider "life expectancy" a good reason. The only two mech boxes I can see this affecting are TM's (280 anyways) and PTWs)
Is there a reason we SHOULD change the spring? You've still not shown any evidence that it's more dangerous. Not a single shred. So my point still stands. It's not any more dangerous than 300, so why bother changing for people because of some perceived yet non-extant threat.
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Old April 11th, 2008, 05:08   #62
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Quote:
Wow, so one retard in alberta and the rest of the god damned country suffers. Congrats on the kindergarten punishment mentality. Still have not seen any evidence to prove that 350 is more dangerous than 300 when the proper precautions are made.
That was just one example.

But you are right, I shouldn't assume that people can do gearbox work. Also, I shouldn't assume that what appears to be a purchasing fad on ASC (JG's, Krakens etc) applies to everyone.


Quote:
You're crying about FPS limits being too high
I wasn't, I was trying to be accommodating to as much people as possible, but you've brought up some good points (in saying some things aren't good to assume) as to why it can, in the end, be accommodating to less people.

Makes me wonder what the average fps of peoples gun is anyways.
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Old April 11th, 2008, 05:18   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
Makes me wonder what the average fps of peoples gun is anyways.
Manitoba rule: Indoor, 350 FPS maximum, Outdoors, 400 maximum if you want full auto, 470 single shot only. All FPS tested with .20g BBs


Everything across Canada is fairly similar.. give or take 40-50 FPS here and there.
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Old April 11th, 2008, 05:29   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amos View Post
Manitoba rule: Indoor, 350 FPS maximum, Outdoors, 400 maximum if you want full auto, 470 single shot only. All FPS tested with .20g BBs


Everything across Canada is fairly similar.. give or take 40-50 FPS here and there.
I meant more as people's personal guns. What the PDW guys do (they host most of the games here) is 425 full auto, 450 semi (auto disabled), and 475 bolt action.
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Old April 11th, 2008, 06:58   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cushak View Post
I meant more as people's personal guns. What the PDW guys do (they host most of the games here) is 425 full auto, 450 semi (auto disabled), and 475 bolt action.
From what I've seen, it runs everywhere from 330-440 for outdoor guns (as per amos' post). A lot of folks, like myself, only have outdoor guns, so ours are generally higher up on the fps scale.

I'd say for the full auto outdoor guns, they range anywhere from 340-385, some are upgraded internally, others are just fitted with minor things (hopups, barrels), others yet are bone stock. We run the gamut, but most are upper range fps.

Most, however, hare the mid-range and top-end guns. Our snipers are usually running 410-430. My rifle, after upgrades, will be running around 415-420 tops.

---

Now, bare in mind, I'm not against lower fps. I had a stock TM at 310 that I cherished and loved playing with against those with more powerful pieces (until the body went tits up). I'm just about the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" concept. Especially since many of us cannot do our own repairs or simply lack the facilities to do so.
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Old April 11th, 2008, 13:49   #66
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Camo, one thing to keep in mind as well. For the local Saskatchewan teams and fields, we have the rule that new players must run stock FPS for 1 year until they have proven they know gun control and earned the trust of the established players to upgrade to higher FPS. This is mainly to keep everyone from running out and upgrading to 350+ FPS to be at the same levels as some of the "senior" players, and over time many of them find that they do not need to upgrade their guns.

Personally, I've played in just about every province in the country. CQB and Outdoors. I've played with the Calgary guys a few years back at the Laser Tag place they have off McLeod Trail, and there was some rather hot shots that I would have sworn were over 350 on full auto from about 10'. Yes I took the hits and continued to play, but I'm fat and have some extra layers of protection. Honestly, I'd set the limit around 320 to 330 allowing a max of +5 variance above on the chrony tests. This will allow for the odd hot shots on full auto bursts where it might jump by +10. It will also, allow for any newer players that might be coming out who are still prone to blind firing (albeit unconsiously, as I've seen senior players do it now and then), and the last thing someone wants is to be walking up a stairwell turning a corner to have a barrel shoved against their goggles (which could shift them) and said barrel's owner panicing and holding down for a full auto spray before recovering. Yea theres the option to a full face mask, they have holes in them, which last time I check (5 mins ago on 3 different brands/designs) 6mm fit through quite nicely. In CQB I usually wear goggles and a shemag.

This is mainly the reason, I have a couple stock guns now which I'll be keeping stock for CQB, and my upgraded guns will see the day light outdoors.
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Old April 11th, 2008, 14:31   #67
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I want to thank everyone who has voted and has had input on this subject. I'm somewhat sorry that it got heated at times. Not my intention.

I am fully aware now that there will continue to be a wide spread until everyone comes together on the playing field and sorts it out through actual play. Trying different things. Then at some point in the future there might be a consensus. If not, then not.

Anyway, at this point, I have what I need so thanks again.
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Old April 11th, 2008, 20:54   #68
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And also to add, majority of GBB's (definetly not NBB's) will not fire under 300 fps on propane. My GBB's are for the most part, tuned for propane use and certain ones don't cycle properly on duster (Ie. KJW/WE guns).
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