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Old December 8th, 2007, 21:52   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danke View Post
My card can float it, and my other habits hit the wallet a lot deeper than 4K.

Maybe a written test will help weed out the weak?

go and purchase dental material....you will appreciate buying PTW's that are so cheap to compare...
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Old December 8th, 2007, 21:56   #32
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Buy some clothes from value village, and just go to the soup kitchen.
get another Job....
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Old December 8th, 2007, 22:06   #33
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*sigh*

Dracheous, do you know what the platform of the MP5 is? Do you know it's performance, cost, availability or options?

No, you don't.

I've seen all kinds of fanboy-ism on this site. Evryone goes "OMG!! FAL!! I'm so getting it", then when a FAL comes out, that same guy goes "Meh!!, not for me". People, and especially airsofters, are fickle. They have usually no idea what a gun is about until after they have it.

Look at the classifieds a month or 2 after Company X releases a gun. How many of the latest, newest models comes up for sale? How many used PTWs have you seen for sale? There have been none, a few new revenue guns, but none used.

The platform of the gun is what gives you your performance, but you must invest. You are not only buying a $2500 gun (which will likely be $3000 in January), but you are buying $1000+ in cylinder kits and batteries, plus the money to invest in mags and accessory upgrades. This is now a $4000-$5000 gun, with virtually nothing interchangable with anything else.

How many guys can make that committment? And it is a committment, not only financially, but the committment extend to being able to wait for the assembled gun, and not being sucked in to those damn kits because they are a few bucks cheaper and readily available. The committment is also being able maintain and feed your gun, and not taking the cheap and easy route.

How many guys can afford the PTW, and still have a back-up? Guys who buy kits need to do that, as the kits fail routinely, despite your best efforts. And parts are not always readily available, nor are they cheap.

This is my firss-hand experience with 3 years owning a PTW. You have none. And nobody has any experience with the MP5.

This point is moot until the MP5 is shipping and people are using them.
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Old December 8th, 2007, 22:13   #34
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Couldn't help it.
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Old December 8th, 2007, 22:14   #35
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get another Job....
Sure, wanna find me one?
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Old December 8th, 2007, 22:23   #36
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Wow, this thread turned from being somewhat informative to being an E-***** waving fest.
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Old December 8th, 2007, 22:32   #37
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Sure, wanna find me one?
PM'ed
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Old December 8th, 2007, 22:36   #38
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Wow, this thread turned from being somewhat informative to being an E-***** waving fest.
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Old December 8th, 2007, 23:06   #39
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Wow, this thread turned from being somewhat informative to being an E-***** waving fest.
And what was remotely informative about a "Coming Soon" pic from 2004?

If you can honestly answer and understand why you're buying a PTW from my posts, then perhaps it's informative.

You guys have to decide if a gun with no info on performance, cost, etc is worth buying. You'd be a fool to want it, knowing nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about it. You have no idea what you're getting yourself into.
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Old December 8th, 2007, 23:20   #40
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I'd buy a PTW PSG-1 because it would perform well out of the box. Plain and simple. There's no other reason I'd buy it.

"OOH! FUCK YEA! PTW ROCKSORZ! ITS THE LATEST SHIT SO I GOTTA GET IT FUCK YEA!"

no, no sorry, but that isn't me.
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Old December 8th, 2007, 23:31   #41
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And what was remotely informative about a "Coming Soon" pic from 2004?

If you can honestly answer and understand why you're buying a PTW from my posts, then perhaps it's informative.

You guys have to decide if a gun with no info on performance, cost, etc is worth buying. You'd be a fool to want it, knowing nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about it. You have no idea what you're getting yourself into.
You seriously need to get your head out of your ass buddy. Were you not the same person who in the past has "sworn by the PTW" while looking down at all other brands of AEGs and telling others to follow suite if they were smart? I just find it odd that it seems like all of a sudden you are telling everyone not to get a PTW.

Whats wrong? Too many of them in the country now? Don't feel so special anymore? In the end it is still just a fucking hobby. Christ, a little less hubris would do you some good.

Last edited by GrieverX; December 8th, 2007 at 23:43..
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Old December 8th, 2007, 23:41   #42
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You seriously need to get your ass out of your head buddy. Were you not the same person who in the past has "sworn by the PTW" while looking down at all other brands of AEGs and telling others to follow suite if they were smart? I just find it odd that it seems like all of a sudden you are telling everyone not to get a PTW.

Whats wrong? Too many of them in the country now? Don't feel so special anymore? In the end it is still just a fucking hobby. Christ, a little less hubris would do you some good.
+1
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Old December 9th, 2007, 00:01   #43
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You seriously need to get your ass out of your head buddy. Were you not the same person who in the past has "sworn by the PTW" while looking down at all other brands of AEGs and telling others to follow suite if they were smart? I just find it odd that it seems like all of a sudden you are telling everyone not to get a PTW.

Whats wrong? Too many of them in the country now? Don't feel so special anymore? In the end it is still just a fucking hobby. Christ, a little less hubris would do you some good.

I still believe that the PTW is the best platform available. Sure, it may have some quirks that some may not like. Some don't like the bolt release, some don't like the mag loading. Others don't like the stock. Some don't like the hop-up. I have no problems with any of this.

The problem I do have is everyone wanting to jump on the PTW bandwagon and few have really thought it through. Many people bought them last spring, when supply was good. Now, when supply is not good, far too many are buying kits just to get in the game. See how many guys say "OMFG!! MP5 PTW. I Gots to have!!" We know nothing about it. Those who want it likely know zero about the AR version of the PTW. Sure, maybe they read my posts or posts by others, or they saw one at a game, or maybe they even got to test-fire one. But that means shit.

I would personally like to see the PTW as the only available gun, from any manufacturer. But that is unrealistic and not necessarily the best for those who want other roles or weapons.

Do peole really realize what you have to do to get a PTW these days? Or parts, or accessories? Do they know who to get them from, and who not to? Do you really think I'd like to spend my Saturday eveing trying to convince you guys that maybe you should consider, and I mean really consider, what getting a PTW means? It means compromise. You can't own a PTW and all the related accessoires, and still have an arsenal of other guns to chose from. If you can, you are the wealthiest player here, and more power to you.

And what will the MP5 PTW be? Will it be a fully modular platform like the AR series? Will it use the same gearbox arrangement? Will it be another $5000+ investment? Or will it be a $599 U.S. metal-bodied gun with a Systema complete mechbox? Will it have electronics problems like the Gen 1-2 PTWs did? Will Systema's insistance on using only real HK mag shells still hold true, and will they be $100+ US like originally projected years ago? Will it have all the features that make the PTW what it is, or will it be a compromise?

The point is, nobody knows. But I can tell you for sure that if it's a new and different platform from what the PTW is currently, are you going to want to sell every gun you own and then some to buy one, just one, when it has not been tried and tested for years?

I think someone else needs to get their head out of their ass, look around a bit before piping up about about something you know jack shit about (in fact, nobody except Systema knows about, anywhere), and get a reality check.

What idiot in their right mind is going to sell the farm to get a gun nobody knows about, or has no idea what lay in-store for them? This is the committment I speak of.
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Old December 9th, 2007, 00:13   #44
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I plan to lurk like a trap door spider and snatch one from the near mythical classifieds when baby, marriage, house etc. forces a sale.

Works every time in the rest of the world.

I'm in no rush and I've run custom vs. off the shelf gear before and am aware of the "hole you pour money into" potential for leaving the beaten tracks. Maybe it won't be a MP5 (lesser of 2 evils in my book anyway) maybe a well tweaked AR platform.

Some folks call this living better with information gained while being stupid (or aging for short).
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Old December 9th, 2007, 00:29   #45
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+1 to mcguyer

it takes a large amount of disposable income and a very strong constitution to invest in a PTW. Some can and do buy them.....some dont. But most of all.....those that do usually have done their homework before the purchase.

Buying a new model Systema that has yet to be tested under 'field conditions' doesnt make sense. But then again, this is ASC and more than a few dh's on here dont make sense at the best of times.
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