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Old June 23rd, 2006, 15:53   #181
BloodSport
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Wasnt only Greylocks man...
Yeah i seem to remember you made a stupid thread and got told off by ALOT of people including me ..... but unlike the others you took what you were being told and LEARNE.

I think he should get an ASC FAQ Reader Award!!!
Well actually he received a 7 day timeout from ASC which most likely helped the most. Makes some people sit back and say hmm maybe I should have listened to what they were saying, if it doesnt they usually disappear quite quickly again after the temp ban.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 15:53   #182
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The thing is in most cases the parent buys the gun for them then doesnt supervise.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 15:56   #183
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The thing is in most cases the parent buys the gun for them then doesnt supervise.
Then how is that the child's fault?
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:01   #184
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The child probably nagged and nagged the parents till they gave in.

It's a 50/50 road, unless the child begged for it, the parents would not have bought it.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:04   #185
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Originally Posted by active1x0
So I have a question for all the haters on younger people:

Would it be acceptable for them to save up at 15 or 16, have their parents buy them a nice AEG, and then use it on private land with parent supervision? To me, this seems like the most logical solution. It's a compromise.

People come to this forum because they want to play Airsoft, which is great; the more responsible players the sport has, the better reputation it will get with the general public. If the underage people who complain want to get a gun, what's the problem with them getting one? As long as they have their parents buy it, and then only use it with a parent monitoring them, wouldn't that be a better way than just saying "No gun for you, ever!"? It's even better if they do it with their parents, as the adult will make sure they're handling the weapon properly and with respect. These will develop into habits, and when they turn 18, they have a couple years experience handling a gun the right way. Then they can go to a game on their own and not be a complete beginner, even though they're over 18.

This way, everybody wins, don't you think?
In Canada, we have different laws than the US.

In Canada, you have to be 18 to buy/own, and for most fields there are age requirements to play.

All the people on ASC are saying, we are tired of kids wanting us to change the law on buying and change the law of playing. (Something that we don't set) Field requirements has a lot to do with insurance related issue rather than owners' preference.

There is nothing against parents buying airsoft for their kids to play on private field out of public's sight. Just don't expect a 12 yr be freely going to games without direct supervision from the parent(s).
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:07   #186
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Originally Posted by active1x0
Quote:
Originally Posted by bean
The thing is in most cases the parent buys the gun for them then doesnt supervise.
Then how is that the child's fault?
Yeah, it's not the children's fault for being stupid. It's more of a genetic thing I suppose.

Parents will never have the time to fully understand the implication and complication an airsoft would bring. Kids just nag and nag for their parents to buy them one, and the parents buy it to shut the kid up.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:08   #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by active1x0
So I have a question for all the haters on younger people:

Would it be acceptable for them to save up at 15 or 16, have their parents buy them a nice AEG, and then use it on private land with parent supervision? To me, this seems like the most logical solution. It's a compromise.

People come to this forum because they want to play Airsoft, which is great; the more responsible players the sport has, the better reputation it will get with the general public. If the underage people who complain want to get a gun, what's the problem with them getting one? As long as they have their parents buy it, and then only use it with a parent monitoring them, wouldn't that be a better way than just saying "No gun for you, ever!"? It's even better if they do it with their parents, as the adult will make sure they're handling the weapon properly and with respect. These will develop into habits, and when they turn 18, they have a couple years experience handling a gun the right way. Then they can go to a game on their own and not be a complete beginner, even though they're over 18.

This way, everybody wins, don't you think?
I agree some what to your post.
I think that being a minor, you get less respect, and the market is very limited to you. I do not understand why a minor who understands the risks, is responsible and mature, and plays safely has to be neglected from games, buying an airsoft gun and useing it. Legal or not, if they play on private land, supervised there shouldn't be an issue. I doubt your local authorites are too interested in a situation like that, especially a place like mine where its a full town of 10 000 people. Its like drinking under 19(or 21 in some provinces, 18 in Quebec) if its done responsibly and in a mature manner, there are no issues.
I understand how a real professionaly organized game could not have under age people playing, becuase they whole team/organizer could take a major fall if caught. But some times people need to realized that as soon as you hit 18, you are not automatically mature, or being under 18 your are not a complete selfish jackass out to break things and law.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:11   #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thephenom
In Canada, we have different laws than the US.

In Canada, you have to be 18 to buy/own, and for most fields there are age requirements to play.

All the people on ASC are saying, we are tired of kids wanting us to change the law on buying and change the law of playing. (Something that we don't set) Field requirements has a lot to do with insurance related issue rather than owners' preference.

There is nothing against parents buying airsoft for their kids to play on private field out of public's sight. Just don't expect a 12 yr be freely going to games without direct supervision from the parent(s).
I know the age limits in Canada. We have the same laws in the US - 18 to buy or own. If you're caught, on your own, with an airsoft gun and you're under 18, it's a crime (misdemeanor in some states). I don't understand what I said to make you think I wasn't aware...?

And I realize that you're sick and tired of people trying to change the law for buying - I'm sick of it too. Minors do not carry any accountability; ok, we have established this. What I'm saying is that perhaps ASC should be preaching "get your parents involved so you can learn to be responsible and accountable for a highly-realistic and potentially-deadly weapon" instead of "just wait until you're 18." Just because you turn 18 doesn't mean you all of a sudden are as wise as Socrates or happen to know just how to handle and treat a weapon. Kids should get their hands on a weapon as soon as their parents think they are ready for it, and begin to learn the proper way to treat it; so much of a greater chance they will turn out to be a respectable airsoft player.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:21   #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by active1x0
I know the age limits in Canada. We have the same laws in the US - 18 to buy or own. If you're caught, on your own, with an airsoft gun and you're under 18, it's a crime (misdemeanor in some states). I don't understand what I said to make you think I wasn't aware...?

And I realize that you're sick and tired of people trying to change the law for buying - I'm sick of it too. Minors do not carry any accountability; ok, we have established this. What I'm saying is that perhaps ASC should be preaching "get your parents involved so you can learn to be responsible and accountable for a highly-realistic and potentially-deadly weapon" instead of "just wait until you're 18." Just because you turn 18 doesn't mean you all of a sudden are as wise as Socrates or happen to know just how to handle and treat a weapon. Kids should get their hands on a weapon as soon as their parents think they are ready for it, and begin to learn the proper way to treat it; so much of a greater chance they will turn out to be a respectable airsoft player.
Being 18 doesn't automatically make one mature.

However, as MANY reiterated, being 18 makes the person automatically accountable for their actions.

Yes, parents are responsible for their kids' actions when they are under 18, the last thing we want is some soccer mom getting pissed off because she's reponsible for her son/daughter's stupidity with airsoft. With the powerful soccer moms in Canada, it'd be their priority to ban airsoft completely saying "kids shouldn't be allowed to use airsoft, in fact, NO ONE SHOULD!"

I hope you get the point since everyone pretty much shares similar opinions on this topic.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:23   #190
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Im 15 and getting a job soon so i can save money so when im 18 i can buy what i need. and i think there should be a mesage or something when u first get an account on ASC 2 read the FAQs and other forums before u ask dumb questions, inform the noobs before they do it. just my opinion and i dont think ne one should have a problem with waiting till there 18
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:28   #191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thephenom
Yes, parents are responsible for their kids' actions when they are under 18, the last thing we want is some soccer mom getting pissed off because she's reponsible for her son/daughter's stupidity with airsoft. With the powerful soccer moms in Canada, it'd be their priority to ban airsoft completely saying "kids shouldn't be allowed to use airsoft, in fact, NO ONE SHOULD!"

I hope you get the point since everyone pretty much shares similar opinions on this topic.
I understand that point completely and think it's a valid one. But maybe this points to a bigger problem of parents not taking responsiblity for their kids as opposed to kids abusing airsoft.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:47   #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by active1x0
Quote:
Originally Posted by thephenom
Yes, parents are responsible for their kids' actions when they are under 18, the last thing we want is some soccer mom getting pissed off because she's reponsible for her son/daughter's stupidity with airsoft. With the powerful soccer moms in Canada, it'd be their priority to ban airsoft completely saying "kids shouldn't be allowed to use airsoft, in fact, NO ONE SHOULD!"

I hope you get the point since everyone pretty much shares similar opinions on this topic.
I understand that point completely and think it's a valid one. But maybe this points to a bigger problem of parents not taking responsiblity for their kids as opposed to kids abusing airsoft.

So using this logic, then why should we the community have to take responsibitlity for these kids? We don't, and now you know why we also do not just let parents register and let their kids have the run of the site.

It's simple, yes there are minors who are 16+ that are mature enough to play, heck we have 4 or 5 on our team that are.
But at the same time, there is hundreds who are not, it sucks yes for the minority who are.
But if life was fair I'd be rich, married to Jessica Simpson and have Jennifer Garner sleeping in our bed with us every night. But life isnt fair, it sucks at times.
Deal with it, no sense bickering or bitching, cause you know what, those who are in the position to decide and make exceptions, are going to get annoyed and say screw you all.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 16:55   #193
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So using this logic, then why should we the community have to take responsibitlity for these kids? We don't, and now you know why we also do not just let parents register and let their kids have the run of the site.
What?

Sorry man, no disrespect intended at all, but what in the world are you talking about? Parents are supposed to take responsiblity for their kids - if they can't handle it, they shouldn't have them!!! Maybe I'm not quite following what you're trying to say, but I never said the community needs to take responsibility for minors.

And also, who's bitching? I posed this as a question, barely a suggestion, and never included phrases like "i'm matuhre enuff 2 play becaujase i paly cs and stuff". Is this not a discussion thread? And to add to that, I'm 18, can and do own airsoft guns - I'm not complaining.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 17:18   #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by active1x0
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiseowl
So using this logic, then why should we the community have to take responsibitlity for these kids? We don't, and now you know why we also do not just let parents register and let their kids have the run of the site.
What?

Sorry man, no disrespect intended at all, but what in the world are you talking about? Parents are supposed to take responsiblity for their kids - if they can't handle it, they shouldn't have them!!! Maybe I'm not quite following what you're trying to say, but I never said the community needs to take responsibility for minors.

And also, who's bitching? I posed this as a question, barely a suggestion, and never included phrases like "i'm matuhre enuff 2 play becaujase i paly cs and stuff". Is this not a discussion thread? And to add to that, I'm 18, can and do own airsoft guns - I'm not complaining.
I think you are mis-understanding the point.

What wiseowl was referring to I believe is that the airsoft community shouldn't be responsible for the a kid going wild with an airsoft. Responsible in a sense that the negative press it generates directly affecting this community.

As much as we would LOVE to have ALL the parents in the world understand this sport, it's impossible. As a community, we're not here to change the world, change how parents raise the kids, we are here just to enjoy the sport and obey the rules/laws of the game.
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Old June 23rd, 2006, 17:33   #195
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thephenom
Quote:
Originally Posted by active1x0
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiseowl
So using this logic, then why should we the community have to take responsibitlity for these kids? We don't, and now you know why we also do not just let parents register and let their kids have the run of the site.
What?

Sorry man, no disrespect intended at all, but what in the world are you talking about? Parents are supposed to take responsiblity for their kids - if they can't handle it, they shouldn't have them!!! Maybe I'm not quite following what you're trying to say, but I never said the community needs to take responsibility for minors.

And also, who's bitching? I posed this as a question, barely a suggestion, and never included phrases like "i'm matuhre enuff 2 play becaujase i paly cs and stuff". Is this not a discussion thread? And to add to that, I'm 18, can and do own airsoft guns - I'm not complaining.
I think you are mis-understanding the point.

What active was referring to I believe is that the airsoft community shouldn't be responsible for the a kid going wild with an airsoft. Responsible in a sense that the negative press it generates directly affecting this community.

As much as we would LOVE to have ALL the parents in the world understand this sport, it's impossible. As a community, we're not here to change the world, change how parents raise the kids, we are here just to enjoy the sport and obey the rules/laws of the game.
It's not the fact that the airsoft community is responsible for it, it's the use of the weapons that the chrime was commited with. Since it's an airsoft rifle, they want to get rid of the rifles because that's what was used to commit the crime or offense.
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