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Old December 23rd, 2015, 14:41   #1
Nectarines
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Toronto/North York
Looking for advice considering a beginner gun

Hey all, I live in Toronto, Ontario, just recently joined ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶a̶m̶ ̶i̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶p̶r̶o̶c̶e̶s̶s̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶g̶e̶t̶t̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶a̶g̶e̶ ̶v̶e̶r̶i̶f̶i̶e̶d̶.
I looked around the forums and so far found quite a few answers to questions that I had, but I'm currently looking to buy a good starter gun and after talking to my local airsoft store decided on the G&G CM16 Raider/Raider-L.

I'm planning on taking it into a nearby indoor CQB arena for some speedsofting. Yes, I keep coming across posts saying it's bad, but I'm also planning on joining an 18hr milsim in Picton, I believe it's called NightFall; not too sure, friend just briefly mentioned it, I'll edit in more info when he responds.

So, onto the questions:
Is the CM16 Raider(L) a good choice for a beginner gun for both CQB and Milsim ops? -Note: The arena does do rentals and they are Raiders, I tried them and they seem a bit unwieldy in CQB, might just by my small build.
EDIT: Should I invest in a collapsible/foldable stock if I decide to get the Raider?
Should I invest in something a bit more, but comes with a full metal body or just purchase a full metal body upgrade kit when the stock body starts to warp?
Also can someone give a list of things to consider when preping for milsim, such as how many mags should I have on hand.

If these questions are already answered, can you please link the posts below? Thanks~

Last edited by Nectarines; December 23rd, 2015 at 14:59.. Reason: More info, additional questions, Correction
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 14:49   #2
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It depends on your budget.

If a CM16 is what you can afford, then you should definitely get one of those because it is the best gun available for that price range. As for it being too big, there is a shorter version of it. It all ends up being personal preference really.

If you have 4-500 to spend on a gun, you should definitely be looking at VFC AEGs.

NightFall is a harder event to get tickets to, you have to sign up and pay as a squad and it sells out in minutes. Don't worry, there are other games held at Picton throughout the year if you can't make that one.

Do not buy a full metal kit. It always ends up costing more, and you end up with a Frankengun, hours of frustration or a lot of tech fees. If you want a metal body down the road, I recommend you sell your G&G and get a VFC.

Prepping for a milsim is a lot more than just how many mags you have, its more about how to remain active for the full 18 hours. Think more about food, water, shelter, navigation, communication etc.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 14:52   #3
BioRage
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... but you're already age verified?

/plottwist.


oh god.. speed softing, please, stop. y'all ruining the pew pew scenes. If you're one of those, then just rock a pistol lol and a paintball mask.

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Old December 23rd, 2015, 14:55   #4
Nectarines
 
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@BioRage, When I went to get av'd yesterday, they said it'd take 1-2 weeks, I didn't know that it'd be so quick since they made it sound like it'd take a while.
EDIT: s̶p̶e̶e̶d̶s̶o̶f̶t̶ Causal indoor airsoft is a good choice for me since the majority of my friends are quite new to airsofting, I only played my first game about 6months ago and they're looking to play their first game in the next few weeks.
@Pestobanana, Thanks for the quick reply, I guess I'll hold off on joining the milsim until I get a detailed event of what I should get from my friend. Thanks again for the advice and quick reply.

Last edited by Nectarines; December 24th, 2015 at 00:05.. Reason: Addressing a statement, more information, I don't even speedsoft#lookatdat
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 14:58   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nectarines View Post
@BioRage, When I went to get av'd yesterday, they said it'd take 1-2 weeks, I didn't know that it'd be so quick since they made it sound like it'd take a while.
@Pestobanana, Thanks for the quick reply, I guess I'll hold off on joining the milsim until I get a detailed event of what I should get from my friend. Thanks again for the advice and quick reply.
Everyone is new at some-point, there are some nice threads around on ASC stating what you should bring and what you shouldn't.

I'm sure Night Fall 5 signups will go up early next year, so find a squad and join up.

Skip the raider, borrow your friends gun, and save for a VFC, classified is always open too.

Was a nice VFC SOPMOD that just got sold for $325.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:00   #6
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I think the best gun for all cases is a SYSTEMA PTW. There are a few used ones for sale but they are 1000+. They are very much worth it but if you are looking for something more affordable I would look for guns with fast spring replacement feature (like Magpul PDR-C). It will save you a lot of headache.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:05   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DMB90 View Post
I think the best gun for all cases is a SYSTEMA PTW. There are a few used ones for sale but they are 1000+. They are very much worth it but if you are looking for something more affordable I would look for guns with fast spring replacement feature (like Magpul PDR-C). It will save you a lot of headache.
Ummmmm no.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:09   #8
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No as in you don't like SYSTEMA guns or AEGs with fast spring replacement?
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:15   #9
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Originally Posted by DMB90 View Post
I think the best gun for all cases is a SYSTEMA PTW.
The TW platform is heavily flawed.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:29   #10
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The only problem I have with PTWs is their cost. I have a dozen of different AEGs and GBBRs but stopped using them after I got a PTW. Yes, the parts are more expensive but they are way easier to maintain, way more accurate and give you somewhat of a recoil feeling as opposed to an AEG. The only problem I have had so far was the broken motors which had to be sent to TAC. But once he moded them nothing compares anymore. TAC has a facebook group "Tackleberry's Systema PTW User Group" https://www.facebook.com/groups/180170635373712/ where you can find out more from PTW users.
Otherwise I like the AEGs which allow you to change the spring without having to open up the gearbox.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:33   #11
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:38   #12
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Easier to use an indoor gun outdoors than the other way around. I have an mp7 for cqb and just bought an sr25 to get my DMR on... Something with a shorter barrel could be nice for both.. Buy a silencer, longer inner barrel and m120 spring for outdoor games.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 16:42   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DMB90 View Post
The only problem I have with PTWs is their cost. I have a dozen of different AEGs and GBBRs but stopped using them after I got a PTW. Yes, the parts are more expensive but they are way easier to maintain, way more accurate and give you somewhat of a recoil feeling as opposed to an AEG. The only problem I have had so far was the broken motors which had to be sent to TAC. But once he moded them nothing compares anymore. TAC has a facebook group "Tackleberry's Systema PTW User Group" https://www.facebook.com/groups/180170635373712/ where you can find out more from PTW users.
Otherwise I like the AEGs which allow you to change the spring without having to open up the gearbox.
I have a PTW.

I don't know what recoil you are talking about. PTW motors are horrible, they fail both due to design flaws and Systema's horrible construction. Tackleberry can fix Systema's horrible construction, but it does not change the flawed design. I have seen Tack'ed motors fail in person. The design had to be severely compromised in order to fit inside a 1:1 grip.

PTWs are not more accurate than AEGs.

The only reasons to buy a PTW are 1:1 spec, ease of disassembly for the less technically inclined, and stop on empty. A well built AEG will be far more durable internally, have more durable electronics, will sound much better, will be more efficient, have better battery space, have better trigger response... The list goes on.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 17:04   #14
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if you are into m4s, the CM line is a good place to start around the 200$ mark. The gearbox shell is a bit weak but nothing a couple mods can't fix. The gun itself is very receptive of off the shelf parts and is fairly consistent from one manufacturing run vs the next, so no new issues generally come up.

If you are into AKs, it gets a bit sketchy as you there are good guns at around 200$ and bad guns in that range... all from the same company, though this is more to do with what replica it was cloned from, TM vs VFC. For AKs in the low end price range but reasonable quality, look at CYMA.

outside of that, the guns get more expensive for the aesthetics and components like mags and gear. Gear for m4s and aks is the cheapest as it's the most commonly available and real surplus is dirt cheap, as well as airsoft market stuff.
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Old December 23rd, 2015, 17:43   #15
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I'd say don't bother with the collapsible stock. For the Raider, that's where the battery goes, so you'd have to figure out something for the batter (IE a PEQ box).

For the cost of a new raider, you can generally get something decent in the classifieds though.
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