Airsoft Canada
www.jsairsoft.com

Go Back   Airsoft Canada > General > General
Home Forums Register Gallery FAQ Calendar
Retailers Community News/Info International Retailers IRC Today's Posts

SUPREME COURT OF CANADA RULES. Is this is new news and how this affects us?

:

General

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old November 13th, 2014, 17:27   #1
yaric
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Richmond Hill
SUPREME COURT OF CANADA RULES. Is this is new news and how this affects us?

https://nfa.ca/news/supreme-court-ca...s-are-firearms

SUPREME COURT OF CANADA RULES THAT AIR GUNS ARE "FIREARMS"

On Wednesday, November 5, the Supreme Court of Canada issued its ruling R. v. Dunn, finding that most air guns are considered “firearms” for all purposes in the Criminal Code except for licensing and registration.
yaric is offline  
Old November 13th, 2014, 17:35   #2
Dracheous
Lego Head
 
Dracheous's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Gatineau, that's right I'm in QUEBEC!
Well now, how does that factor for all the retailers of air guns that clearly saw this coming?
__________________
_________________________________

"The hydrogen economy car from the people who brought you the 'Hindenburg'" - Glen Foster

Condoms do not guarantee safe sex any more. A friend of mine wore one and was shot by the woman's husband!
Dracheous is offline  
Old November 13th, 2014, 17:43   #3
waylander
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Already being discussed in the AV section.

http://airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=168597
waylander is offline  
Old November 13th, 2014, 23:22   #4
mickael
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Would it be possible to move the thread into a public section so all the non AVed members can access it?
mickael is offline  
Old November 13th, 2014, 23:46   #5
Kokanee
Ministry of Peace
 
Kokanee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Spruce Grove, AB
It anything this ruling HELPS the sport because this is the actual Supreme court ruling that airguns are firearms, not the CBSA just saying they are.

The sky is not falling, go about your business people.
Kokanee is offline  
Old November 13th, 2014, 23:51   #6
Ricochet
Can I ask you a serious question? How much sand can you fit in your vagina?
 
Ricochet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: North Delta, BC (Greater Vancouver)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokanee View Post
It anything this ruling HELPS the sport because this is the actual Supreme court ruling that airguns are firearms, not the CBSA just saying they are.

The sky is not falling, go about your business people.
LiIKE BUTTON!!!

Exactly right. There is NO banning or restriction to airsoft in anyway. It MAY change the way we transport and store our guns, but probably not. It MAY illegalize the ownership of airsoft guns to certain criminally charged individuals, but probably not. That's worst case scenario, but by no means shocking, scary or unreasonable to the Canadian airsoft community.

Settle all nerves!
__________________
“REALITY IS LIKE A STONE. TO MANY IT’S HARD AND COLD, THEY CAN’T HUG IT OR EAT IT, IT ONLY FRUSTERATES THEM AND DOESN’T DO THEM MUCH GOOD. TO OTHERS IT’S STRONG AND DEPENDABLE, YOU CAN BUILD WITH IT, BUILD UPON IT, OR WORK WITH IT, ALSO USE IT TO SMASH PEOPLE IN THE FACE.”
Ricochet is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 00:00   #7
Chillyrabbit
 
Chillyrabbit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokanee View Post
It anything this ruling HELPS the sport because this is the actual Supreme court ruling that airguns are firearms, not the CBSA just saying they are.

The sky is not falling, go about your business people.
air guns have real uses too besides airsoft, people compete with air rifles already. So an outright ban on a legitimate sport that uses firearms seems unlikely and from reading it it may even legalize airsoft that can shoot above 214 fps. But the CBSA can still play by its own rules.
Chillyrabbit is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 13:17   #8
Cameron SS
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Hi Guys, I am new to the forum. I am a firearms enthusiast, and an active user over on a popular firearms forum. This issue is being much discussed there, and I wanted to come here to see specifically if, how, and what the Airsoft community was doing in reaction to this very significant ruling.

I am not a troll I swear, but I do have a legal background that tells me that this court ruling is going to significantly impact the Airsoft and Paintball sports unless it is addressed by legislation from Parliament.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mickael View Post
Would it be possible to move the thread into a public section so all the non AVed members can access it?
Agreed. I have not yet done the age verification thing, and would very much like to be able to join that discussion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokanee View Post
It anything this ruling HELPS the sport because this is the actual Supreme court ruling that airguns are firearms, not the CBSA just saying they are.

The sky is not falling, go about your business people.
Sadly, I think you have grossly underestimated the importance of this ruling.

The Criminal Code makes it an offence to point a firearm at someone. You can not consent to a criminal code offence, and there is no waiver.

With ALL barreled weapons firing projectiles faster than 214 FPS being classified as Firearms, it is now an CRIMINAL offence to point an Airsoft gun at a person. This essentially prohibits person vs person Airsoft use.

Also, if you live in a municipality that has a ban on the discharge of firearms, it is now prohibited to discharge an Airsoft gun as well, regardless of what you are shooting at.

It is also now illegal to modify a semi auto airsoft gun to become full-auto.

People with prohibition orders as a result of a criminal conviction are also now prohibited from being in possession of airsoft guns. Anyone caught giving, selling, or offering to give or sell Airsoft equipment to someone not authorized to have it can be convicted for weapons trafficking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricochet View Post
LiIKE BUTTON!!!

Exactly right. There is NO banning or restriction to airsoft in anyway. It MAY change the way we transport and store our guns, but probably not. It MAY illegalize the ownership of airsoft guns to certain criminally charged individuals, but probably not. That's worst case scenario, but by no means shocking, scary or unreasonable to the Canadian airsoft community.

Settle all nerves!
There is no MAY about it.

Airsoft guns are now officially subject to the Criminal Code regulations for storage and transportation, display etc. They have been for a while in fact, but it has now been affirmed by the Supreme Court of Canada, and without legislation, it can not change.

Airsoft guns are now ALSO subject to the regulations for magazine capacities, meaning restricted Airsoft handgun magazines with a capacity of more 10 rounds are prohibited devices, and are illegal to own. Restricted Airsoft Rifles, and any automatic Airsoft gun magazines containing more than 5 rds are now prohibited devices, and are illegal to own.

It is also now an offence to carry any Airsoft firearm concealed, which includes anywhere on your person, in your bag, or in your car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chillyrabbit View Post
air guns have real uses too besides airsoft, people compete with air rifles already. So an outright ban on a legitimate sport that uses firearms seems unlikely and from reading it it may even legalize airsoft that can shoot above 214 fps. But the CBSA can still play by its own rules.
Many things that have real uses are regulated under law, up to and including being restricted or prohibited all together. Many things and sports that were at one point in time considered legitimate, and sometimes still are considered legitimate, are regulated. Airsoft is now one of those things. Unfortunately, it is now regulated by the most oppressive and onerous section of Canadian law, being the Criminal Code.

I am not sure of the legal issues specific to Airsoft guns and CBSA/Importation etc that you are referring to, but I suspect this ruling will substantiate and support what CBSA has already been doing for some time. Prior to this ruling there was nothing that made +214 FPS Airsoft illegal, but it is certainly MORE regulated now than it was before.

Last edited by Cameron SS; November 14th, 2014 at 13:32..
Cameron SS is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 13:26   #9
Kokanee
Ministry of Peace
 
Kokanee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Spruce Grove, AB
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron SS View Post
...
The Criminal Code makes it an offence to point a firearm at someone. You can not consent to a criminal code offence, and there is no waiver.

With ALL barreled weapons firing projectiles faster than 214 FPS being classified as Firearms, it is now an CRIMINAL offence to point an Airsoft gun at a person. This essentially prohibits person vs person Airsoft use.
...
So all those years I spent in the army "pointing" my rifle at people and shooting blanks (or yelling "bang bang" during the leaner years) during training events I was committing a criminal act?
Kokanee is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 13:29   #10
Cameron SS
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokanee View Post
So all those years I spent in the army "pointing" my rifle at people and shooting blanks (or yelling "bang bang" during the leaner years) during training events I was committing a criminal act?
No, because the Criminal Code exempts police and military from the vast majority of Firearms offences when connected with their lawful duties, which includes training.
Cameron SS is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 13:54   #11
MaybeStopCalling
Green Synergy
 
MaybeStopCalling's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Cameron SS, I suggest you go back and check your facts. Last I checked, magazine capacity requirements as stated here:

http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/b...323-72-eng.htm

Mean that airsoft guns would have to be centrefire or rimfire for magazine capacity requirements to apply. Calm down, and do your research. Please. The last thing we need is for panic or fear mongering to take hold in the community.
MaybeStopCalling is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 13:55   #12
Drake
E-01
 
Drake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Montreal, QC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron SS View Post
Sadly, I think you have grossly underestimated the importance of this ruling.
Do you know understand what the ruling was? Do you even know what the specific case in question was about?





Quote:
With ALL barreled weapons firing projectiles faster than 214 FPS being classified as Firearms, it is now an CRIMINAL offence to point an Airsoft gun at a person. This essentially prohibits person vs person Airsoft use.
The 214 fps bit was presumably intended for for pellet guns, in the context of the court case. The defined parameters set out for airsoft guns (0.2g@366fps) haven't changed, nor has the CCC been changed in any way.





Quote:
People with prohibition orders as a result of a criminal conviction are also now prohibited from being in possession of airsoft guns.
That became true two years ago.


Quote:
Anyone caught giving, selling, or offering to give or sell Airsoft equipment to someone not authorized to have it can be convicted for weapons trafficking.
Not according to the CCC.





Quote:
Airsoft guns are now officially subject to the Criminal Code regulations for storage and transportation, display etc.
No, they are not. As quoted in the other thread, the CCC specifically identifies parameters for low power airguns (including airsoft which are not considered to be Replica Firearms) which are exempt from the Firearms Act (which covers storage, transportation, etc).


Quote:
Airsoft guns are now ALSO subject to the regulations for magazine capacities
Again, no.



Quote:
It is also now an offence to carry any Airsoft firearm concealed, which includes anywhere on your person, in your bag, or in your car.
On your person in public, yes (but that was always the case). In your car its fine, just as its always been.






Quote:
Prior to this ruling there was nothing that made +214 FPS Airsoft illegal, but it is certainly MORE regulated now than it was before.
Nothing makes them illegal now (unless someone secretly amended the CCC overnight), and its sub-366 fps airsoft guns which remain illegal.


While I appreciate your enthusiasm, I think you should inform yourself a bit better about the law, airsoft, and please refrain from posting misinformation as fact.
__________________
Drake is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 13:59   #13
Kokanee
Ministry of Peace
 
Kokanee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Spruce Grove, AB
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake View Post
Do you know understand what the ruling was? Do you even know what the specific case in question was about?...While I appreciate your enthusiasm, I think you should inform yourself a bit better about the law, airsoft, and please refrain from posting misinformation as fact.
Kokanee is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 14:06   #14
Drake
E-01
 
Drake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Montreal, QC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokanee View Post
Indeed.

But given the level of ignorance/panic I'm seeing on here and FB groups, I think its better to inform people properly.
__________________
Drake is offline  
Old November 14th, 2014, 14:06   #15
Kokanee
Ministry of Peace
 
Kokanee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Spruce Grove, AB
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cameron SS View Post
...The Criminal Code makes it an offence to point a firearm at someone. You can not consent to a criminal code offence, and there is no waiver.

With ALL barreled weapons firing projectiles faster than 214 FPS being classified as Firearms, it is now an CRIMINAL offence to point an Airsoft gun at a person. This essentially prohibits person vs person Airsoft use.
Wrong. The criminal code states:

87. (1) Every person commits an offence who, without lawful excuse, points a firearm at another person, whether the firearm is loaded or unloaded.
Marginal note:Punishment

(2) Every person who commits an offence under subsection (1)

(a) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years; or

(b) is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction.


Playing airsoft is a "lawful excuse", if you consent to being a participant in a game. So there is no problem for players playing the game.

THere is a problem for people misusing airsoft, ie going downtown and shooting people etc... What this ruling does is give law enforcement the teeth to go after offenders who are causing problems for the sport.

THIS RULING IS A GOOD THING FOR THE SPORT.
Kokanee is offline  
Closed ThreadTop


Go Back   Airsoft Canada > General > General

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Airsoft Canada
www.jsairsoft.com

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 17:14.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.