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Old September 24th, 2005, 14:05   #31
Pyro
 
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Location: Richmond Hill, Ontario
Quote:
Originally Posted by liam_995
And by the way - all my appointments with my doctor are health related and necessary - I was just suggesting during ONE of these visits that he take an extra 60 seconds to help out with the Age Verification process. If that offends anyone... :shock:
In Ontario, OHIP will cover the cost of your doctors visit, but as soon as you want the doctor to sign any sort of document or write you any kind of note, they can and will charge you money because it's not an OHIP related expense.
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Old September 24th, 2005, 14:19   #32
liam_995
 
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How many sellers who have websites have you bought from who may have asked for I.D. (DL) on first transaction and now will ship to you no problem? (Trumart is one, for example - read his f.a.q.! I can buy anything I want from him, as long as I fax my DL - doesn't that sort of shoot down your whole age verification process to keep AEGs out of under-age buyers right out the window...? If it's good enough for him... ). Or sellers well known to members of this community should be more than acceptable.

And if my dentist who I've been seeing for 15 years is willing to help me out - what's wrong with that? Isn't that between him and me - and no one else's business?

You keep throwing up those objections - and I'll keep replying to them.

Cheers! :nod:
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Old September 24th, 2005, 14:48   #33
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I dont know, i dont think my doctor could charge me anything to sign a note, i don't know how close are you guys from your doc but i have been going to me family Doc since i was 5
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Old September 24th, 2005, 14:56   #34
liam_995
 
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Oh - just a small note. I went back and checked my email logs, and apparently it was more like 4 months ago I tried to contacy my V.I. Rep...and this is the best and only system you will accept for Age Verification? And you wonder why I am trying to offer alternatives. :smack:
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Old September 24th, 2005, 17:14   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liam_995
Oh - just a small note. I went back and checked my email logs, and apparently it was more like 4 months ago I tried to contacy my V.I. Rep...and this is the best and only system you will accept for Age Verification? And you wonder why I am trying to offer alternatives. :smack:
If you are unhappy with your local rep, contact Meat, and explain the situation.

Reps are not going to call your Doctor, Dentist, Mechanic, or corner store cashier to make sure the papers you fax are you and are authentic. As for having other sellers verify you, well some of the sellers/buyers are 18 and still hang with 16-17 year olds. I'm not saying all would verify their 16 year old buddies, I'm just saying there are too many holes.

Keep beating the bushes though, you may just come up with a viable solution.
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Old September 24th, 2005, 17:25   #36
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I will be working on expanding the verification options in the very near future.

Just swamped with other ASC related work at the moment.
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Old September 24th, 2005, 17:33   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liam_995
Oh - just a small note. I went back and checked my email logs, and apparently it was more like 4 months ago I tried to contacy my V.I. Rep...and this is the best and only system you will accept for Age Verification? And you wonder why I am trying to offer alternatives. :smack:
Look. Regional age verification reps aren't on call, 24/7, to the beck and demand of any Joe Airsofter out there. They don't do AV for a living. They have jobs, families, and other commitments that on the grand scale of things often outweigh airsoft, despite what we all say about being HARDKOR.

Most of these reps do AV whenever they can. I'm sure many have gone out of their way to. No one sits at home, refreshing ASC and their PM box, just waiting for another person to request verification, then jump in their batmobile and get to the interested party at lightspeed. I'm sure you have your own priorities as well - would you rather a) spend quality time with your kids on the one weekend when you have no take-home work, or b) spend the entire day driving all over the goddamn place verifying airsofters in ones and twos?

Are there problems with ASC's AV process? Probably. Is introducing new third, fourth, fifth parties the answer? Probably not. Is clogging up ANY professional worker's time the answer? Absolutely not. As has been said, we're looking into getting more reps per area - but you don't just get any Joe Airsofter with 1 month on the board and is just a fresh AV'er himself to turn around and start collecting AVs.

The AV protocol here is for the ability to see and post in the restricted areas of the forum, namely the Buy and Sell areas for guns. Tru, and any other retailier, sit outside of this process. They are self-run distributors and have established their own rules. Don't want to be AV'd but need that airsoft gun right this second? Buy from Tru or any other distributor.

Not unlike a driver's license, a motorcycle license, a trucker's license (sorry FF!), LSAT scores, mail-order brides, and Canada Post regular parcel shipping, things don't happen unto you overnight. You have to wait... and in many cases, wait and wait. This is especially true when the process in question is of a much lower priority. Like in the doctor's office, take a seat, grab a dog-eared copy of last month's Cosmopolitan, and wait patiently.
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Old September 24th, 2005, 19:25   #38
liam_995
 
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So you honestly think that not even replying to an email for over 4 months is a perfectly acceptable way to act as a Rep? You call that wanting "instant" service? "Too much workload for one person?". You do realize that Vancouver Island has a total population of about 500,000 people, of which I seriously doubt less that 1/4 of 1% have any interest in getting "Age Verified" on Airsoft Canada...and that is a very conservative estimation. So, at MOST, there might be 125 people sending off one email each over the course of a year to one person. And those 125 emails, spaced over a year, can't at least get back a reply of some sort - to show their "Rep" is doing what he voluntered for...?

I just read a "Junk" thread on "clear" CT Crosman Soft Air guns and got a real good look at the secrecy and paranoia that permeate this community. Everyone is so worried about the Feds banning Airsoft that you are all walking on eggs all the time when it comes to your "too realistic" looking guns. I won't rehash the massive thread that it became - but it made me feel claustrophobic just reading all the remarks about how "one" incident could cause Airsoft guns to be banned. And yet Co2 pellet guns (which I own a few, one a perfect looking copy of a Glock - and yes could kill with a shot thru the eyeball into the cerebral cortex, and yes are often used to kill small game animals and "nuisance" animals - even non-Pal versions), and Paintball guns (too large and flashy to be banned - yet kids have been charged with deliberately firing at people from a moving car) are O.K. because they aren't these (oh, my god!) so, so dangerous, dreaded "too realistic" Airsoft Guns...

Keep your rules about "Age Verification" and all your paranoia, secrecy and fears among your community and I'll stay out here in the sunshine and not be at all worried if the Feds come to their senses one day and put restrictions on co2 guns that should have been in place a long time ago. Until that day - I'll keep having fun with them and buying and trading them openly on the Internet.

Cheers! :cheers:
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Old September 24th, 2005, 19:56   #39
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Good bye then. You won't be missed. Oh, don't let the door hit you on the way out.
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Old September 24th, 2005, 20:09   #40
MMMiles!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liam_995
Keep your rules about "Age Verification" and all your paranoia, secrecy and fears among your community and I'll stay out here in the sunshine and not be at all worried if the Feds come to their senses one day and put restrictions on co2 guns that should have been in place a long time ago. Until that day - I'll keep having fun with them and buying and trading them openly on the Internet.

Cheers! :cheers:

If you want to make suggestions, I suggest you make them to the administration. The users of this site are not the ones who make decisions about it, they choose to stay or go baaed on the atmosphere we create here - if people don't like our policy of age verification, they are welcome to go elsewhere.

AV notwithstanding, we are still the largest airsoft site in Canada, and one of the largest in the world. If it's too much to handle to be apart of this community, noone is forcing you to stay.

Furthermore, you should also not let a single thread colour your view of the entire community. I unilaterally implemented age verification (with the support of the staff here, I just didn't tell anyone until I actually threw the switch), and it had nothing to do with being paranoid, or wanting to keep airsoft a secret. In my province, we actually have laws regarding the age requirement for purchasing airsoft, so we enacted age verification to set a standard for the community as a whole. It isn't intended to stop all under age players from getting guns, merely to treat the sport with respect. If their parents or guardian think it's ok for them to own one, I have no problem with it.

If retailers or other communities don't want to follow our standard, that's alright. We're just making an effort to increase - to whatever degree - the maturity level that people will approach the sport with. That is the intention of age verification.

As far as using a doctor to help you get verified, I'd rather extend the verification options to something simpler. I haven't had time to discuss options with the rest of the staff, it might be credit card based, maybe driver's license, who knows, but we're going to try and extend the options available to people who want access to the buy/sell area. If you feel you have constructive advice to give, I would direct it towards the people that make the decisions, rather than slogging it out in a public forum.

Cheers :cheers:
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