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Old September 5th, 2013, 08:13   #1
Softysteve
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Emonton
A plethora of noob questions!

Ok! First off I've had my first taste of airsoft and I fear I may even leave my 5 years of paintball behind to start this hobby!

The stickys were very informative and cut my list of noob questions considerably!

1.) I have pm'd an Edmonton AV and will hopefully get that sorted out soon! Is there a way that after I get AV'd that I too could become an age verifier myself in order to help speed up the process?

2.)I've narrowed down the list and I'm interested in opinions on good quality airsoft brands preferably an electronic assault rifle or even SMG, I realize this question is common, however newer and better airsoft weapons are constantly being improved and added, and there seems to be many to choose from.
Ideally if I could get directed to a good site with descriptions of these weapons I could continue my research more accurately.

3.)Many of the forums suggest that sniper rifles are best left to the experienced players, and from what I've read so far I'm assuming it's due to the higher fps that these put out and the min distances that they should be fire from? It would seem spring loaded is the way to go, any brands that are preferred? Also I heard that using one requires a course. Is this true?

4.) I played a few rounds at Quest for Adventure paintball the rental was a magpul (not sure of the model). What are your thoughts on the quality of this brand?

5.) what is your dream airsoft weapon? Everyone usually has something they drool over or are saving up for!


Thanks for all your time and patience!



Steve
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Old September 5th, 2013, 11:11   #2
Reaver_RRTS
 
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Originally Posted by Softysteve View Post
Ok! First off I've had my first taste of airsoft and I fear I may even leave my 5 years of paintball behind to start this hobby!

The stickys were very informative and cut my list of noob questions considerably!

1.) I have pm'd an Edmonton AV and will hopefully get that sorted out soon! Is there a way that after I get AV'd that I too could become an age verifier myself in order to help speed up the process?

2.)I've narrowed down the list and I'm interested in opinions on good quality airsoft brands preferably an electronic assault rifle or even SMG, I realize this question is common, however newer and better airsoft weapons are constantly being improved and added, and there seems to be many to choose from.
Ideally if I could get directed to a good site with descriptions of these weapons I could continue my research more accurately.

3.)Many of the forums suggest that sniper rifles are best left to the experienced players, and from what I've read so far I'm assuming it's due to the higher fps that these put out and the min distances that they should be fire from? It would seem spring loaded is the way to go, any brands that are preferred? Also I heard that using one requires a course. Is this true?

4.) I played a few rounds at Quest for Adventure paintball the rental was a magpul (not sure of the model). What are your thoughts on the quality of this brand?

5.) what is your dream airsoft weapon? Everyone usually has something they drool over or are saving up for!


Thanks for all your time and patience!



Steve
Welcome to ASC!~

To answer your first question, becoming an ASC Age Verifier will require a year or two after becoming age verified yourself (if what I was told was correct, I'm also planning to be an AV later once someone finally gets in touch with me >.> ) I'm sure there's a link somewhere on here about becoming one lol

Second: This depends more on budget. If you have a ton of cash, Systema is a well known, high quality, and EXPENSIVE gun. For just starting out, first take a look around local stores near you, or online at various sites to see what kinds of guns are out there, settle on a style (M4, M16, G36C, M249, etc etc) of rifle you want to play with, as well as role. Obviously if you pick up a SAW you're gunna be more a supportive role rather than front line assault (sometimes, but not always depends on your play style). We are not permitted to state what sites as you are not AV'd. Just ASC rules. Anyway, there's tons of brands, G&G, ARES, KJW, KWA, WE, KA and many more that I can't recall lol but each has it's brands' version of various guns with different parts/performances/pricing so it's really up to you as to how much you want to spend and what kind of gun you want. Assault rifles are usually the classic M4 and because it's such a common gun parts are usually SUPER easy to get if something breaks or you want an upgrade. SMGs are a little more rare as they don't usually see a lot of action outdoors (at least where I am) so they are more an indoor style gun, but the MP5 is a workhorse for a reason. P90's are nice, but bulky and tend to be a brick and magazines can be finnicky. Again, all personal preference.

Likewise, sniper rifles are not recommended for beginners because it takes a lot of money and time to build it into a weapon that can out distance any other AEG rifle, BUT you lose the capability of follow up shots due to bolt action systems.. unless you go as a Designated Marksman, in which case an AEG will do just fine such as the SR25 or SVD Dragunov... or even the WA2000 :P And yes, a sniper course is required for players who want to use rifles that exceed 400 FPS which is the normal limit at most fields. Regular rifles CANNOT exceed that limit, only snipers who have passed the sniper courses can... and of course that means snipers have a minimum engagement distance (MED) depending on the FPS of their rifle. The higher the FPS the bigger the MED is, which is the distance in which a sniper is not permitted to target a player with their sniper rifle. IE if MED is 120 feet, anyone within 120 feet of the sniper is NOT to be shot with their sniper rifle.

Never used a Magpul I'll leave that to others.

And my dream weapon is the G&G F2000 (and I already own it :P) it's my favourite bullpup style assault rifle. Second is the WA2000 but those are too expensive for me to purchase.

Welcome to the sport, and have fun!

~Reaver

Last edited by Reaver_RRTS; September 5th, 2013 at 11:21..
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Old September 5th, 2013, 13:33   #3
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should be noted, more fps doesn't give you more range or accuracy.
The two real advantages of a bolt action rifle are silence and accuracy
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Old September 5th, 2013, 14:07   #4
Danke
 
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1) You need to be in the house for a while first to be vetted and there needs to be an actual shortage of active verifiers in the area.

2) Arnies Airsoft has a good and active review section. Plan to spend a lot more over the course than you though you would. You can start out cheap though to see if you've got the taste for it. Go hands on as much as you can since something that you think you really like will be awkward to manipulate once it's in hand.

3) Sniper rifles as a rule have the same range as an AEG but a very low volume of fire. Until you've got a good grasp of the mechanics and flow of the game plus have mastered stalking you'll be sorry. We once played a game with about 8 new snipers who were repeatedly slaughtered. Unless you're into that it's no fun.

4) Magpul PTS gets stuff from other makers and puts their own touches on it. Some are OK, some can be a problem. Nothing sadder than a new player who's out because he blew the budget but his AEG has gone down and either parts can't be found or he can't afford them.

5) I've spent the last couple seasons running gas rifles and really enjoyed what they do. I'm considering trying out a PTW or a the new TM recoil shock but I'm just not sure about going back to batteries.
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Old September 5th, 2013, 17:22   #5
Azathoth
 
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I'm a lot more local and to answer your questions

1. I answered this in a PM
2. Arnies Airsoft is a good place for English speaking countries. Avoid retailer/youtube reviews as they are generally useless
3. Visit Edmontonairsoft.net regarding the Certification for high energy bolt action. Their is a course In Edmonton, Red Deer has one, and Calgary is developing their course or it's already in place. You will not be permitted to bring a high energy >1.65j Bolt action rifle onto a field unless you have certification from one of the three clubs for major events. Almost all games hosted/posted on these three clubs require high energy BA users to have the course in order for you to take the rifle onto the field.

Their are no preferred brands. For Spring guns, expect to spend upwards of $1000 on aftermarket parts to make the platform playable. For Gas guns expect to spend 500-1000 on parts to make the system reliable and provide a safe consistent energy. That is on top of the cost of the gun in both cases


4. Black Cobra Airsoft or Quest for Adventure partnered with imperial Airsoft Edmonton, and purchased the G&P Magpul guns. Quest heavily upgraded them. Expect to spend 500 for a base gun, and another several hundred if you want it to perform comparably. G&P makes excellent airsoft quality externals and some aftermarket parts (motors). depending on the batch their complete guns are considered just above or just below 'midgrade'.
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Old September 5th, 2013, 17:41   #6
lurkingknight
 
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4. Expect to spend 500 for a base gun, and another several hundred if you want it to perform comparably.
this is reasonably accurate. You can do about 300 on just rifle these days and 200 in upgrades go a long way if done right.

500 for rifle mags and batteries/charger is accurate. Prices go up from there.
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Last edited by lurkingknight; September 5th, 2013 at 17:44..
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Old September 6th, 2013, 01:14   #7
Softysteve
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Emonton
Excellent!

This should help get me started! I look forward to playing with and/or against you all next season! Thanks again for taking the time to help me out!


Cheers,


Steve
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Old September 6th, 2013, 12:23   #8
Armyissue
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Dude, you gotta loose the PaintBall way of thinking.
AirSoft is more a modern re-enactors hobby than a shooting sport.
So
After 2 years of active participation in the community you may possibly have gained recognition and built a good reputation among your peers.

The kind of ASG in your hand is not as important in AS as it is in PB. So take the one you like, its a Toy to be fondled and played with. It performance scale can be adjusted.

playing a sniper role requires you to go out in the woods and often lay there for the whole game and never fire a shot. This is not COD MW3. Targets will not come by 30 seconds after you're set up. When most people start to play AS they want Full Auto run and gun creeping through the woods camaraderie action and War Stories. Laying still for 6 hours is best accomplished on a sofa.

If you want to know what the new dream weapons are look at the
This is the M4 thread
AKStravaganza
POST you Shotty
SCARS who Gott'em
and those kind of threads are always full of the new Hot-mess

Welcome to Airsoft, it's a lot like a new Girlfriend, all the goodies you want to play with and the different places to play. A lot of us have been "married' a long time and the enthusiasm is replaced by experience. Good Bad and otherwise.
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Old September 9th, 2013, 00:37   #9
Kuro_Neko
 
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If you could state how much you're willing to spend on the various parts of kit we would be able to advise you better.

Manufacturer is generally more important then the style. Generally all airsoft aeg's work the same so how it looks like outside is up to you. Though the advice in the Airsoft Newbie Buying Guide about styles is good. Generally ak47, m16/m4 or mp5 are good starter gun styles due to the availability of accessories and upgrades.

Sniper rifles are very much *not* recommended for newcomers for a variety of reasons. The foremost among them is price; a good accurate sniper rifle is going to cost you a minimum of a thousand dollars, probably more like fifteen hundred or more. Second, unlike in real steel, an airsoft sniper rifle doesn't have much more range then an upgraded aeg and a considerably slower fire rate. When you can only fire one round every couple of seconds and your opponent can fire sixty is the same time frame, considerable skill is required. Otherwise you'll just get slaughtered every game, which is no fun.

I'll add my weight to the argument of cheap vs quality. Get the highest quality gun you can afford, you'll thank yourself in the long run. Upgrading a low grade gun to match a high grade gun almost always costs considerably more then simply buying the high grade gun in the first place. Not to mention having your gun break down on you in mid game due to cheap parts sucks rocks.

Another thing to consider is resale value. You don't want to spend too much cause you're not sure you'll stick with it? That's actually a good reason *to* get a high grade gun rather then not to. You spend $600 on a Classic Army gun and, provided you've taken decent care of it, you have a very good chance of recouping most if not all of that $600 back. On the other hand, the classifieds are continuously flooded with people trying to offload Aftermath guns with no luck.

Please keep in mind that the prices listed below are rough. I've seen each of the listed at the price given but that was months/years ago and I don't religiously follow pricing trends. They should be used as a guideline only.

For $200, the best you could manage is Aftermath (CYMA rebrand) stuff. Both the Broxa (full stock MP5) and the Kraken (AK47) are decent bargain basement guns, about $160 or so each. Stay away from Aftermath's Kirenex or Knight (both M4 variants) and the Lycaon (collapsible stock MP5) though, not a good rep.

If you're willing to go up to $300 you could get a JG. Yeah JG's are China clones but they're getting quite respectable nowadays. JG's M4 runs about $290. You could get one of the G&G M4's for about $340. G&G is the cheapest of the midgrade guns. $400-$450 would get you an ICS which is a slightly higher end midgrade gun. $500-$600 would get you a G&P, there's some debate on whether this is the lowest of the higrade guns or if it should rank higher. Either way they make nice guns.

If you can afford it, highgrade guns such as Tokyo Marui or Classic Army are the way to go. They're going to run you $600-$700. Though if the M4/M16 style is what you want then I'd recommend staying away from stock TM's, the barrel wobble and creaking are pretty bad on the stock TM M4/M16's (yes the new TM M4/M16's have fixed this problem, but the bulk of the ones in country are the old ones so best to just avoid them for now).

I did extensive research and settled on the Tactical Carbine version of the Classic Army M15A4 (basically a full stock m4) as my first gun. If an Armalite is what you're looking for then I think it's the best of all possible versions. You have the shortened M4 carbine barrel, which makes you less likely to smack your barrel off something when turning quickly, combined with the full stock which houses a large battery. Small batteries don't have near the run time of a large battery, not to mention that the reinforced slip ring (the ring that keeps the fore-grip on) is really strong. While this is mostly a good thing and a big step up over CA's previous M15 versions, it makes changing small batteries in the field very difficult if not impossible.

CA's M15A4 series in general is a big step up over their previous versions and as far as stock armalites go they're probably the best. All metal where the real steel version is, the plastic parts where the real steal version is plastic are made of high quality enhanced nylon fiber rather then abs for great texture and feel. Classic Army has a deal with Armalite so you get all the proper markings. Plus that deal also goes to show the quality of the manufacture, Armalite wouldn't put their name on a shoddy product.

Internally the gearbox is reinforced metal and all the gears are metal as well. It fires hotter stock then Tokyo Marui's as well, firing at 300-320 fps where your average TM only fires 280-300 fps.

All in all this is a great starter gun if you can afford it. Because it's all metal you don't have to worry nearly as much about breaking it and you won't get any of the wobble or creaking that is infamous in stock TM M4/M16's. Unfortunately affording it is the biggest problem, they're not cheap. For reference I got my CA M15A4 from the classifieds, upgraded with a bunch of Systema internals to fire 390fps, for $600 shipped which was a great price.

As you can probably tell, I'm a big fan of Classic Army. One thing to keep in mind about Classic Army is they now have two lines, a proline and a sportline. Originally they were easy to tell apart because the proline had the metal body and the sportline had a plastic body but recently CA has been releasing their sportlines with metal bodies. The price tag should still allow you to easily tell the difference, the sportline being $300-400ish and the proline never being cheaper then $500, usually more like $600 or more but it's still something to keep in mind. All the pros that I went over above were regarding the proline model. The sportline model has cheaper everything internally and externally.

There's alot of people that will expound the virtues of G&P as well. And I'll admit the externals of G&P are very nice, easily on par with CA, in some cases better. The reason why I don't say G&P over CA though is much the same reason why people weren't big fans of CA up until a few years ago: their quality control for the internals is not the greatest. That means a fair number of lemons. CA got a handle on this a few years ago and they've been making great strides in terms of their rep ever since, but G&P isn't quite there yet. This is simply my personal opinion and there are many people that would likely disagree with me, but it's something to keep in mind. ICS is about a cheap a gun as you can go and still get full metal out of the box. One thing to remember about ICS is they like to go their own way internally, so upgrading them inside will be more difficult then other brands. And needless to say it's not in the same league as CA or G&P. It's what someone on a budget but determined to get full metal would aim for. I should probably give TM some love here as well: Due to Japanese laws TM guns fire alittle cooler then most others and their externals are going to be almost entirely abs plastic. But *nothing* beats TM for internal reliability. You leave a TM stock internally and it will last for literally decades.

One of the perks of going with an M16/M4 variant is that mags are dead easy to come by and dirt cheap. You can get Star brand mags for like $5 a mag or less, plastic yeah but sturdy none the less (Star is also one of the few brands that makes realcaps too). Metal mags will run you a fair bit more, $15 to $30 a mag. There's no real reason to go with metal over plastic for mags except looks/realism. Though of course if you're going to go hicap then you might as well get metal ones. As to Brands, TM and CA make good mags. I've heard pretty good stuff about MAG brand mags as well. King Arms not so much, especially for M4/M16 mags. Star is always a good affordable fallback too.

Some people say you need to shell out for batteries, mags, camo, chargers and ammo in the begining. Most of that isn't necessary right off the hop. The stock battery will do you for awhile. Most of the guns come with a hicap (high capacity (300-600 rounds)) mag that will also do for awhile. I do agree that a good charger would be a sound initial investment, but not a total requirement, especially if you plan to get a good battery down the road and don't care if the cheap wall charger fries your stock battery. Camo isn't really required in the beginning either, just some dark clothes. Ammo, yeah obviously a requirement but even good ammo (BB Bastard) only costs $10 for two thousand rounds.

So truly, all you really need to start is the gun, a bag or two of ammo, good eye protection (which will run you between $30 and $50) and decent footwear (combat boots are the best but $40 hiking boots from walmart will do in a pinch). That said, if you can afford it then it all helps. Camo would cost about $100, a chest rig or vest would cost another $100. A good loadout of mags, even the cheap Star mags, are going to cost at least $50. A good charger is at least another $50, with another $50 for a good battery. A sidearm is another thing that people like to have but isn't really necessary. A decent sidearm would cost you between $250 and $350. Probably another $100-150 for a duty belt, a holster, a sling, gloves, kneepads and a misc pouch or two.

Sidearms aren't really required right away so if you're on a limited budget then hold off on the sidearm for now. If you have the budget for it then what you want in a sidearm depends on two factors (besides cost of course) whether or not full metal is a must and exactly what model you're partial to. Certain manufacturers tend to make certain models better then others. If full metal is a must then the best choice that isn't going to cost you an arm and a leg is probably KJW, especially for the M9 which they do very well. You'll see alot of WE's around, they're cheap and full metal but tend to have problems, especially their 1911 models. KJW has a rep of having mag problems, but I have had two KJW pistols and I haven't had any trouble with my mags. If full metal isn't a must then WA or TM would be very good choices.

If you're planing on using your pistol frequently as a primary or using it for CAPS style target shooting then go with the hicapa. The hicapa is basically a doublestack version of the 1911. If you're interesting in tricking out your pistol then you should definitely go with the hicapa, the bulk of pistol upgrades out there are all for the hicapa. And get a TM hicapa if you do get one, since all the upgrades are for TM. Yeah, other pistols are TM compatible, but that's not quite the same.

As you can see from the above (very rough) prices, airsoft is not a cheap sport. It's generally accepted that the absolute minimum you need to get into it is $500, and it's usually more like $1000-$1500 if you go with quality gear. I've seen a few people do it for less then $500, but it takes a fair bit of time, effort and jury-rigging. And of course quality tends to be a problem at that level.

Now for some gun pron:

My Classic Army M15A4 Tactical Carbine without external addons:


My baby, CA M15A4 Tactical Carbine with m203 grenade launcher, red dot sight and taclight:
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