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Old January 25th, 2013, 15:52   #1
comarius
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Richmond Hill, ON
New to AirSoft

Hi,
Marius, Richmond Hill, close to 50's y. Just got into the fever of air soft guns.
I start with a question.

I am searchin for a while for a full metal M4 , prefer blow back, good for outdoor. I looked at COLT, ASR101, Javeline, .. and so on. I even setup a custom google search engine that searches among 40 or so canadian based stores/webs, just to have an overall picture. I cannot came up with a pick. Anyone can answer?

Which M4's is a one to worth the money, solid, well made up to, full metal,
plenty of shoots for a fillup.
Which way to go electric or gas. For gas, how many shoots are / one fill up.

Thank you.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 15:55   #2
Brian McIlmoyle
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For GBBR M4 .. 30 shots per fill of the mag generally , you may get more .. but most mags only hold 30 rounds anyway.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 16:04   #3
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Check the WE M4, heard was pretty good but you'll next to buy piece to lower is FPS (too hot out of the box)

I think KWA making on too, normally there guns a very good and already ready to use.

Someone may have better info, I just found this on some french forums.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 16:13   #4
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For a first time gun
I would suggest an electric gun (AEG)
Its a cheaper start
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Old January 25th, 2013, 16:19   #5
Ricochet
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Originally Posted by R.I.T.Z View Post
For a first time gun
I would suggest an electric gun (AEG)
Its a cheaper start
^This. Definitely start with an AEG before a gas system, as gas has their own unique set of issues.

If a GBBR is what you want, and you have the money to invest, get yourself an RA-Tech custom WE M4 open bolt level III. It's already been reinforced and upgraded. They also come with a flow control valve to adjust your FPS.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 16:33   #6
comarius
 
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NIce feedback

Thank you. Very usefull. Really appreciate the warm welcome.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 16:49   #7
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What's your budget? For AEGs, everyone recommends the "King Arms full metal M4" as a solid and inexpensive starter, or you could jump right into a System PTW M4.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 18:58   #8
comarius
 
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What's your budget? For AEGs, everyone recommends the "King Arms full metal M4" as a solid and inexpensive starter, or you could jump right into a System PTW M4.
That's a good option. COLT, AEG or GAS?
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Old January 25th, 2013, 19:37   #9
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I've never heard of a COLT airsoft mechanism - it might be that we're getting some terms mixed up.

An AEG is an "Automatic Electric Gun" - basically, a gun that has a cylinder of air, that an electric motor winds up, and then releases when you pull the trigger (along with accepting a new BB into the chamber).
A GBB (Gas Blow Back) is a gun that has a reservoir of gas in the magazine (usually propane or CO2) that releases gas from the magazine in order to propel the BB out the barrel. This gas pressure also moves the bolt or slide back, to allow another BB to enter the chamber.

As far as I know, the only thing "COLT" means in the airsoft world, is the firearms manufacturer.

So the first thing to decide when you're looking for an airsoft gun is what mechanism you want to use - AEG or GBB.
AEGs are simpler in some respects, until you try to open the gearbox. They're more common, less expensive, and definitely recommended for newcomers. You pop in a $40 battery, jam in a $15-$30 magazine of 30-300 BBs, and pull the trigger.
GBBs are a simple mechanism to fire, but they take a little more maintenance than an AEG, and their magazines are expensive.

Once you've established that, you need to find what model of gun you want. With an M4, there's a ton of variants (well, AR15 variants) - but pretty much every company offers your "basic M4A1", with either rails or handguards.

Since you've established you want an M4 (you can look around at different variants if you want), that is full metal, you now need to find what manufacturer you want to buy from. You'll want to pick a manufacturer that creates a gun with solid externals, and good internals. Unless you're going to be opening it up, tinkering around with it, upgrading parts, etc, you'll want one that's good out of the box.

So what I meant in my last post, was that a good mid-range company to look at to purchase an AEG M4, is King Arms. It'll probably run you $250-$350 for the gun, and then another $100 for the mags, and another $50-$100 for a battery and charger. (Usually the guns come with a single high cap mag, which holds 300 BBs, and a low end battery, and lower end charger, so you can put off these costs until you want to actually game the gun).
If you want to spend a couple thousand dollars, there's a company called Systema that makes "Personal Training Weapon" (PTW) M4s, that are high quality AEGs, that are meant to be as close to a real M4 as possible, with the exception of the gas blowback part.

If you establish that you want an AEG M4, others might come along and suggest looking at AEGs from other companies, such as VFC.

I would recommend looking at what you have available to you - as in, look at retailers that are in Canada. The majority of AEGs being sold internationally will fire at a muzzle velocity that is too low to import (thus, it will be seized at the border as an "imitation firearm", which is illegal to import, rather than an "unregulated firearm", which is importable). After you have an idea of what you have available, compile a list of what models/manufacturers you like, and do some research on each one, to get an idea of where each one stands.

It's overwhelming at first, but as you begin to narrow things down, starting from AEG vs GBB, all the way down to what Canadian stores/websites have in stock, things become far less confusing. Keep in mind there's a lot of duplicates-with-minor-changes from the same manufacturer. What I mean by this, is that a retailer might have five different M4s from the company G&G, but really, the only difference is that the first one has a longer barrel, the second has a different rail system, the third has a different stock, etc. It's all the same internals (usually), so go with whichever one you like the look of (and/or feel of, if you happen to be able to walk into a store that sells airsoft weapons)

Within Canadaian retailers, there's probably no more than a dozen different manufacturers, so if you take the time to look at what is available in Canada, and learn about the manufacturers, you'll be able to wrap your head around what gun is a good buy.

I hope that helps give you an idea of how to narrow down your search!
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Old January 25th, 2013, 20:49   #10
comarius
 
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Thank you. Very very usefull.
You guys, really hellped me a lot. Thank you.

Last edited by comarius; January 25th, 2013 at 20:51..
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Old January 25th, 2013, 22:29   #11
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If you could state how much you're willing to spend on the various parts of kit we would be able to advise you better.

For a first time gun I would highly recommend you go with an AEG (automatic electric gun) as apposed to a GBBR (gas blow-back rifle). GBBR's are more expensive and require more maintenance. They also won't work in cool weather, and the mags cost considerably more then an AEG's mags.

I did extensive research and settled on the Tactical Carbine version of the Classic Army M15A4 (basically a full stock m4) as my first gun. If full metal m4 is what you're looking for then I think it's the best of all possible versions. You have the shortened M4 carbine barrel, which makes you less likely to smack your barrel off something when turning quickly, combined with the full stock which houses a large battery. Small batteries don't have near the run time of a large battery, not to mention that the reinforced slip ring (the ring that keeps the fore-grip on) is really strong. While this is mostly a good thing and a big step up over CA's previous M15 versions, it makes changing small batteries in the field very difficult if not impossible.

CA's M15A4 series in general is a big step up over their previous versions and as far as stock armalites go they're probably the best. All metal where the real steel version is, the plastic parts where the real steal version is plastic are made of high quality enhanced nylon fiber rather then abs for great texture and feel. Classic Army has a deal with Armalite so you get all the proper markings. Plus that deal also goes to show the quality of the manufacture, Armalite wouldn't put their name on a shoddy product.

Internally the gearbox is reinforced metal and all the gears are metal as well. It fires hotter stock then Tokyo Marui's as well, firing at 300-320 fps where your average TM only fires 280-300 fps.

All in all this is a great starter gun if you can afford it. Because it's all metal you don't have to worry nearly as much about breaking it and you won't get any of the wobble or creaking that is infamous in stock TM M4/M16's. Unfortunately affording it is the biggest problem, they're not cheap. For reference I got my CA M15A4 from the classifieds, upgraded with a bunch of Systema internals to fire 390fps, for $600 shipped which was a great price.

As you can probably tell, I'm a big fan of Classic Army. One thing to keep in mind about Classic Army is they now have two lines, a proline and a sportline. Originally they were easy to tell apart because the proline had the metal body and the sportline had a plastic body but recently CA has been releasing their sportlines with metal bodies. The price tag should still allow you to easily tell the difference, the sportline being $300-400ish and the proline never being cheaper then $500, usually more like $600 or more but it's still something to keep in mind. All the pros that I went over above were regarding the proline model. The sportline model has cheaper everything internally and externally.

Now for some gun pron:

My Classic Army M15A4 Tactical Carbine without external addons:


My baby, CA M15A4 Tactical Carbine with m203 grenade launcher, red dot sight and taclight:
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Old January 27th, 2013, 02:42   #12
comarius
 
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I liked the pictures up here. Now Is much clear where I am going. My budget is around CAD $500,

Last edited by comarius; January 27th, 2013 at 02:48..
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Old January 27th, 2013, 03:16   #13
Curo
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Better to stay away from anything electric blow back (EBB) at your budget
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Old January 27th, 2013, 12:21   #14
mzo
 
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My first airsoft firearm was WE M4 Open Bolt GBBR (bolt really means chamber, I think).

I have really enjoyed it and I am very happy with my purchase and this is what I can tell you about it.

-It has some but not much recoil while AEG's have none, that is a plus since I am used to shooting real steel (firearms) and do enjoy the bang and recoil of real steel.

-It requires more maintenance than AEGs, that again is a plus since it makes it seem more realistic and still easier to maintain than real steel.

-Magazines for it will hold what the real magazines would hold (30 rounds) and are expensive to buy. AEG mag is about $12-$15 while GBBR mags are $50 and above, based on what I have seen.

-Had to get a gun doc to install a NPAS on it to meet the muzzle velocity limits of playing fields, it cost around $28 and took a week.

-If willing to pay for it a gun doc can instal steel internals and make it that much more durable.

-The only problem I have had with it is that lower part of the rail system (on the barrel) keeps falling off. It seems the delta ring is supposed to cover the rail system preventing it from falling off (I have never owned an AR platform so Im not sure how true that is) but the delta ring is too thick and has trouble fitting over the rail system. Of course there are solutions for this such as electric tape, plastic zip ties or the best option sand it to fit.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 20:03   #15
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Neko's point about a large battery in the stock is another thing to look for. Some M4s have the battery in the front hand guard, while others have it in the stock. (Front wired vs rear wired, respectively). I prefer my battery in my stock, but it doesn't make a whole lot of difference to me. You may find that if you have a front wired gun, your battery won't fit in the hand guard, so you have to use a "battery box" (a little box that goes on your front rails).
Large batteries aren't much of an issue anymore, because there's LiPo batteries now, that are small, and hold a lot of power. (Do a little research before you buy one though. They can be dangerous if mishandled, and can die if not charged/discharged correctly).

So yeah, front vs rear wiring is something that you may want to keep in mind. (Not a huge deal though)
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