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Old September 1st, 2011, 09:16   #1
anphelproject
 
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FPS

So I am wondering if other people are having this issue.

resently I have bought a couple guns and both are shooting around 430 FPS on .2

now my local field is a 400FPS field but they reconize that the guns comming into Canada are shooting hotter then this so they are asking for chrono to be done with .25 thus making most guns shoot around the 400 FPS mark.

what I am wondering is do most people downgrade the spring in thier gun to go to a field that still chronos with .2 or should fields start to allow chronoing with .25?

just a public poll to see where your at with this .....
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Old September 1st, 2011, 09:24   #2
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a gun that shoots 430 with .2 will still shoot 430 with .2s even if you put .25 in it. Th4 400 with .2s limit is actually energy based 400 fps with .2 bbs is 1.5 joules of energy, that is the limit at fields. 400 fps with .25s is 1.86 joules of energy.

In essence, any field that has any idea how physics work will either raise their fps limit to 430-450 with .2s or require everyone to put a weaker spring in their new guns (which you should anyways as the super strong ones will fuck up most guns)
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Old September 1st, 2011, 09:52   #3
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The rules for conservation of momentum (energy) is based on velocity and mass (energy = mass x velocity). The 0.20 g BB is used as a baseline reference to determine momentum. If you know what the round's mass is, then conservation of momentum will pretty much dictate what the velocity must be.

In Canada, the momentum limit was determined by the RCMP, and enforced by the CBSA (more or less). The RCMP's determination is based on the energy requirements to break skin, which is about 1.5 Joules. Therefore, working backwards and solving for velocity, this is where the 400 fps limit comes from (based on a 0.20 g BB). Increasing velocity with a 0.20 round, or increasing BB weight with a 400 fps limit, will result in the energy value increasing above the "skin break" threshold (i.e., greater than 1.5 J).

Downgrade your spring to a s110 or s120 for safety reasons. If the field is allowing hot guns on, and this is how they are resolving the 400 fps limit, then they weren't paying attention to grade 11 physics.
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Old September 1st, 2011, 10:20   #4
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Originally Posted by anphelproject View Post
So I am wondering if other people are having this issue.

resently I have bought a couple guns and both are shooting around 430 FPS on .2

now my local field is a 400FPS field but they reconize that the guns comming into Canada are shooting hotter then this so they are asking for chrono to be done with .25 thus making most guns shoot around the 400 FPS mark.

what I am wondering is do most people downgrade the spring in thier gun to go to a field that still chronos with .2 or should fields start to allow chronoing with .25?

just a public poll to see where your at with this .....
Which field is this? Because either you are misinterpreting things or they are completely missing the point of chronying to begin with.

At many fields doing what you described would be construed as cheating.

The objective of chronying guns is to ensure that they're under a certain power limit...so as to be fair for everyone. The limit (whatever it may be) is set by the host/field/owner...sometimes by preference, othertimes by insurance.

Some fields/games/hosts will simply up the limit for everyone.
...others will say "the max w/0.20's is 400...w/0.25's it's 370...w/0.30's it's 310...etc..." because they all translate to about the same power level of the BB coming out of the barrel
...others will load 0.20's into your mag and set a limit

Re. what the limits are...that's up to the field/host/owner. Be it 350fps w/0.20's...400fps w/0.20's...450, 475, sub-500, etc... Some games are "whatever"....but those are not public games.

To do what you describe does not make any sense.

Last edited by m102404; September 1st, 2011 at 10:25..
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Old September 1st, 2011, 11:59   #5
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Originally Posted by anphelproject View Post
So I am wondering if other people are having this issue.

resently I have bought a couple guns and both are shooting around 430 FPS on .2

now my local field is a 400FPS field but they reconize that the guns comming into Canada are shooting hotter then this so they are asking for chrono to be done with .25 thus making most guns shoot around the 400 FPS mark.

what I am wondering is do most people downgrade the spring in thier gun to go to a field that still chronos with .2 or should fields start to allow chronoing with .25?

just a public poll to see where your at with this .....

I assume the local field is Adrenaline Paintball, and not flagswipe?
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Old September 1st, 2011, 12:25   #6
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I assume the local field is Adrenaline Paintball, and not flagswipe?
Go figure, not surprised if it is
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Old September 1st, 2011, 13:24   #7
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430 fps is not that bad....aslong as you are smart about it center of mass shots only don't take a shot that you would not want to be hit by. My G&G m14 ebr shot 409....with .28s which is 487 with .20s i still used it but never even really aimed it at people for kills just kept their heads down so my team could flank them or what not replace the spring or get a gun doc to do it for you if your not 100% comfortable doing it yourself some are easy some are hard to do. Sometimes when you buy a gun it will come with the spring that will lower the fps, but i don't think they are much money anyway.
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Old September 1st, 2011, 13:56   #8
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Originally Posted by anphelproject View Post
now my local field is a 400FPS field but they reconize that the guns comming into Canada are shooting hotter then this so they are asking for chrono to be done with .25 thus making most guns shoot around the 400 FPS mark.
That's completely moronic and defeats the purpose of chronying.

As others have explained, it amounts to saying "The speed limit is 100 and you're driving over that limit at 150kph, but we'll just measure your speed in MPH instead so you're still under 100."

Whatever field that is needs to pull their head out of their ass and unfuck themselves.


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Originally Posted by slink182 View Post
In Canada, the momentum limit was determined by the RCMP, and enforced by the CBSA (more or less). The RCMP's determination is based on the energy requirements to break skin, which is about 1.5 Joules. Therefore, working backwards and solving for velocity, this is where the 400 fps limit comes from (based on a 0.20 g BB). Increasing velocity with a 0.20 round, or increasing BB weight with a 400 fps limit, will result in the energy value increasing above the "skin break" threshold (i.e., greater than 1.5 J).
The original limits, back in the day, came more from trial and error
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Old September 1st, 2011, 15:01   #9
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This Document (Click Here) shows the relationship between the various weights of BB's and their energies at a specific velocity... It does more than that, but that's one of its key functions :P
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Old September 1st, 2011, 15:07   #10
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That's completely moronic and defeats the purpose of chronying.

As others have explained, it amounts to saying "The speed limit is 100 and you're driving over that limit at 150kph, but we'll just measure your speed in MPH instead so you're still under 100."

Whatever field that is needs to pull their head out of their ass and unfuck themselves.




The original limits, back in the day, came more from trial and error
Can't say any better myself!
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Old September 1st, 2011, 15:08   #11
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First thank you to those who gave information around why FPS is what it is. and at no point in time did i feel I asked about people political opinion on fields....

I dont see how this is cheating nor is it moronic, everyone chonos with .25s so it is a level field. it is the exact same as a field that says you must chrono with .12 as long as the messurement that each person is being judged by is the same then there is no issue.

but thank you to those who posted and explained why .2 are the measurement system that is in place. I will change out the springs as that seams to be what most have said that were helpful rather then bashing fields.

and as for the fields, I believe that both flagswipe and Adrenaline use .2 to measure.

I also have read some fields will allow for snipers to go to 450 even read one field 500....
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Old September 1st, 2011, 15:10   #12
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Originally Posted by anphelproject View Post
First thank you to those who gave information around why FPS is what it is. and at no point in time did i feel I asked about people political opinion on fields....

I dont see how this is cheating nor is it moronic, everyone chonos with .25s so it is a level field. it is the exact same as a field that says you must chrono with .12 as long as the messurement that each person is being judged by is the same then there is no issue.

but thank you to those who posted and explained why .2 are the measurement system that is in place. I will change out the springs as that seams to be what most have said that were helpful rather then bashing fields.

and as for the fields, I believe that both flagswipe and Adrenaline use .2 to measure.

I also have read some fields will allow for snipers to go to 450 even read one field 500....

My field allows AEGs up to 450 w/ .2g (with MED of 30 ft) and bolt actions up to 550fps w/ .2's, but they have an MED of 75 feet. Pistols are 350 fps /w .2g max, with an MED of 10ft or "don't be a dick" distance.
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Old September 1st, 2011, 15:17   #13
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Originally Posted by anphelproject View Post
I dont see how this is cheating nor is it moronic, everyone chonos with .25s so it is a level field. it is the exact same as a field that says you must chrono with .12 as long as the messurement that each person is being judged by is the same then there is no issue.
Because it isn't about a level playing field. It's about safety. shooting 400 with .25s is a lot more energy and potential for injury that shooting 400 with .20s
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Old September 1st, 2011, 15:40   #14
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My field allows AEGs up to 450 w/ .2g (with MED of 30 ft) and bolt actions up to 550fps w/ .2's, but they have an MED of 75 feet. Pistols are 350 fps /w .2g max, with an MED of 10ft or "don't be a dick" distance.
550fps ?

holy darn! thats hot! (in the sense that it is very strong, not in the sense of "cool")

While your "regular" field allows for 1.5 joules for AEGs and 1.9 joules for bolt action, yours allows for 1.9 for AEGs and a whooping 2.8 joules for bolt actions! 2.8! I wouldn't want to receive a BB in my face! :S. That must hurt like a bitch!

fields around here only allows 1.9 for your "regular" snipers and 2.3 for snipers who attended a special sniper clinic... 2.8 for any person who owns a sniper rifle is a little too much in my opinion... but hey that's just me. I like my teeth and I'd love to keep them for a while lol.

By the way, did you know that an air gun that shoots over 500fps is considered a firearm in canada? I wonder what happens with the different BB weigths though... 500 with .2 is only 408 with .3... is it considered a firearm only when you shoot .20? even though it has the same energy??
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Old September 1st, 2011, 15:50   #15
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Yeah, it's pretty fast. My rifle shoots 430 fps w/ a .3, which is... roughly 2.6J. But because of the (relatively) long flight distance, it doesn't hurt TOO much. We do however recommend the use of shamaghs or mouth guards for every player around here. I've never been hit with my own rifle (probably should be), but I've seen people yelp pretty good when they get hit.

Good thing I live in the States then. As a Canadian citizen who moved, there's a lot of things I hate about living here. The fact that I can use whatever damn airsoft gun I like (except for Systema M4s) is not one of them \o/
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