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Old May 29th, 2005, 14:35   #1
Gob
 
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question about fps

Hi, i saw that on various events and normal outdoor games fps limit are 400 for AEG and 450 for bolt rifles (sniper).

I was wondering how can you snipe anyone if they can shoot as far as you (and much faster) ?

thanks
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Old May 29th, 2005, 14:38   #2
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Dont be seen. Ya dont stand around in an orange jump suit and be a sniper. You get covered in shit lieing in the dirt and brush shooting people who cant see you.
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Old May 29th, 2005, 14:58   #3
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In most case, snipers rely on precision and camoflage skills.
The FPS don't make the sniper, it only help a little.

It's still frustrating to botch an ambush, be seen and get shot by an upgraded AEG when you yourself is at the maximum range of your BA rifle. Happenned to me once, never will happen again, I hope.
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Old May 29th, 2005, 15:12   #4
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Sniping is only a style of game. When we say sniping in airsoft, it doesn't mean that you can shoot your target thats 400 feet away. Yes, your sniper rifle can shoot the same FPS as an upgraded AEG, but your style changes completely. Semi shooting, camouflage skills like Fox said, ect. Not every player out there could stand prone for several hours waiting for the appropriate time to shot.
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Old May 29th, 2005, 16:01   #5
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alright, thanks
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Old May 29th, 2005, 16:10   #6
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FPS alone doesn't determine the range.. My rifle shoots about 20-40% farther than my brothers gun which shoots around 380 fps. (mines 430) and is generally a heck of a lot more accurate. I was playing mostly as a marksman rather than a sniper in the last game which seemed to work pretty well as I could usually outrange the folks we were playing with.

And they wont wanna rush you if theres a machinegunner spotter with you. :grin:
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Old May 29th, 2005, 17:02   #7
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Remember though, with a bolt action.. it's not the same "semi auto" as a pistol or non BA rifle. There is time spent while you cock the weapon. So the rate of fire is exponentially slower than that of a true semi auto weapon.
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Old May 29th, 2005, 17:29   #8
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I'll add that the choice of BB weight affects things as well. My CA M24 shoots about 420fps with .2 (315fps w/ .36g) and with full hop up, I get .30g BBs out to about 150ft before the fps drops to the point that wind and hop up take over sending the BB of it's path. Shooting the same way with .36g, generally I'll get well out past 200ft before the BB drops (I HAVE hit a 12" tree trunk a few times at 230ft away using .36g BBs).

Sniping in airsoft is a hell of a lot more than just using a bolt action gun, or being able to out-range AEGs. Has a pretty widespread mental game attached to it as well. Like basic sharpshooting when attacking a defended base, scouting ahead of a team, harrassing fire from various ranges, etc. Last game day I played, I crawled into a spot about 20mins ahead of my team, a small ridge maybe 150ft away from the nearest wall of a large base we were attacking. Wind was pretty bad from the south, I was west of the base, and couldn't hit crap all due to it, even with .36g BBs. So, all I did was lob shots at all four walls, keep guys guessing where I was and to keep their heads down while my boys attacked. Even from 300ft away, teammates could hear the loud SMACK of my .36s hitting walls. When the game was over, one guy asked if I was located south of the base (I wasn't) as he could hear the rounds hitting over there. Basically I just harrassed the heck outta them. Nothing really sniper that game, just I crawled into a good spot, and used my range and heavy BBs to do my thing. No one took a shot my direction (once I was the last guy alive, they hunted me down and swarmed me), even after one of the tower guys spotted me. I just moved 30ft along the ridge to a more secure spot.

Some genius (either not understnading the 3D aspect of sniping as a whole, or only having a full 100% knowledge that airsoft is a "Ballistic experts WORSE nightmare!) claimed that "There are no snipers in airsoft, only lucky shots!" Well, there is some truth in there, but a lot of other things add together to make an airsoft sniper an airsoft sniper. Not just about the gun you use, or the range you can shoot it from. A lot has to do with field craft, etc. same as has been mentioned above.

And, notice early on I said what my bolt action shoots at, and the range I can get heavy BBs out to. Relies a lot on the amount of hop up used, as well as the 6.03mm barrel I have. Not really fps dependant in some cases. Am sure that if you took an upgraded 450fps AEG, put enough hop up on to send a .36g BB flying a long way, that you'd get virtually the same effect. Can't claim that for sure though, since I have yet to personally come across that hot of an AEG, but am sure it helps with your question.
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Old May 29th, 2005, 18:37   #9
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Quote:
Can't claim that for sure though, since I have yet to personally come across that hot of an AEG, but am sure it helps with your question.
:-D

No comments lol
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Old May 29th, 2005, 19:09   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDN_Stalker
I'll add that the choice of BB weight affects things as well. My CA M24 shoots about 420fps with .2 (315fps w/ .36g) and with full hop up, I get .30g BBs out to about 150ft before the fps drops to the point that wind and hop up take over sending the BB of it's path. Shooting the same way with .36g, generally I'll get well out past 200ft before the BB drops (I HAVE hit a 12" tree trunk a few times at 230ft away using .36g BBs).

Sniping in airsoft is a hell of a lot more than just using a bolt action gun, or being able to out-range AEGs. Has a pretty widespread mental game attached to it as well. Like basic sharpshooting when attacking a defended base, scouting ahead of a team, harrassing fire from various ranges, etc. Last game day I played, I crawled into a spot about 20mins ahead of my team, a small ridge maybe 150ft away from the nearest wall of a large base we were attacking. Wind was pretty bad from the south, I was west of the base, and couldn't hit crap all due to it, even with .36g BBs. So, all I did was lob shots at all four walls, keep guys guessing where I was and to keep their heads down while my boys attacked. Even from 300ft away, teammates could hear the loud SMACK of my .36s hitting walls. When the game was over, one guy asked if I was located south of the base (I wasn't) as he could hear the rounds hitting over there. Basically I just harrassed the heck outta them. Nothing really sniper that game, just I crawled into a good spot, and used my range and heavy BBs to do my thing. No one took a shot my direction (once I was the last guy alive, they hunted me down and swarmed me), even after one of the tower guys spotted me. I just moved 30ft along the ridge to a more secure spot.

Some genius (either not understnading the 3D aspect of sniping as a whole, or only having a full 100% knowledge that airsoft is a "Ballistic experts WORSE nightmare!) claimed that "There are no snipers in airsoft, only lucky shots!" Well, there is some truth in there, but a lot of other things add together to make an airsoft sniper an airsoft sniper. Not just about the gun you use, or the range you can shoot it from. A lot has to do with field craft, etc. same as has been mentioned above.

And, notice early on I said what my bolt action shoots at, and the range I can get heavy BBs out to. Relies a lot on the amount of hop up used, as well as the 6.03mm barrel I have. Not really fps dependant in some cases. Am sure that if you took an upgraded 450fps AEG, put enough hop up on to send a .36g BB flying a long way, that you'd get virtually the same effect. Can't claim that for sure though, since I have yet to personally come across that hot of an AEG, but am sure it helps with your question.
that was very usefull, thank you. I have another question relating heavier bbs. For exemple if i buy an asp-2 type 96 with a 500 fps kit, it will be 500 fps with that kind of bbs? If you use .36, would the fps be reduced? If not, whats the point of a 500 fps kit, or can you cut the spring to reduce it or something like that?
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Old May 29th, 2005, 19:36   #11
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500fps with 0.20g

All guns are chroned with 0.20g and must not exed the limit velocity with 0.20g. The user is free to use any other BBs after that.

My M24 chrony at about 450fps with 0.20g, and drop to 420 fps with 0.30g
I have yet to chrony it with my 0.36g teflon coated (Still in the mail).

So yes, the eveyer the BBs, the lower the FPS.

When you have a eavy BBs, you get a nicer ballistic curve witch allow you to determine a more precise point of impact.

I strongly suggest that you get a lower velocity kit than 500fps.
At 500fps, your rifle is not gamable at most field.
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Old May 29th, 2005, 19:38   #12
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If you buy a gun that shoots 500fps, with .20, it wont be allowed at any game I know of and is pushing the limits of legality (federal laws). Guns are tested at games with (normally) .20 ammo.

Use a standard velocity gun for now, and learn to use it well instead of pushing the safety rules. Most snipers I've seen shoot around 350fps anyway, and that is just fine.

When you learn to make that plastic BB fly straight and true by using your hopup correctly without you being seen, you win. Until then, there is no upgrade that will make any difference except as a risk to others.

That's the only trick; dont be seen. For the rest, get in contact with local players, go to games, see what's used and why it's used. There are a few excellent snipers in Quebec. (You may want to clarify where you live, it's a big province).
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Old May 29th, 2005, 20:18   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moving_target
Quote:
Can't claim that for sure though, since I have yet to personally come across that hot of an AEG, but am sure it helps with your question.
:-D

No comments lol
Ya, but like I said, I haven't tried your SG-1 yet! Hehe, still, like Ive said to you, gotta get that beast under control unless you have throwing BBs as a back up planned for next game day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gob
that was very usefull, thank you. I have another question relating heavier bbs. For exemple if i buy an asp-2 type 96 with a 500 fps kit, it will be 500 fps with that kind of bbs? If you use .36, would the fps be reduced? If not, whats the point of a 500 fps kit, or can you cut the spring to reduce it or something like that?
I'll cut out the filler of what I said before, and tell you this. Personally, I've found close to a 100fps difference between using .2g BBs and .36g BBs. Where my M24 will read ~420fps with .2g, I'll get about 315fps with a .36g BB. Keep in mind that upgrades are meant to get heavier BBs to the target faster. Heavier BBs are used to cut through brush easier (.2g BBs are BADDDDDDD at getting anywhere when more than just air is in the way), and to be more resistant to crosswind conditions. So, you use a heavier BB to ensure longer range, while maintaining a felt hit more than just a single raindrop, and to get through light obstacles to increase the chances of a confirmed "kill". No one in airsoft upgrades a gun with the mentality of causing more pain to someone, it just gets damn frustrating to dump a full low cap of .20g BBs on a guy 50ft away, behind tall dead grass, to have none of them get through to get a hit (stock MP5). Am damn sure if I had have been using .25g BBs, I could have used less ammo in the same case. Once you sort out using better (heavier) ammo, you'll see that an upgrade is pretty much only 25% of the performance upgrade needed to make things work well. Upgrade doesn't make a light BB defeat brush or distance better, it just makes a heavier BB get there a bit faster.
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Old May 30th, 2005, 11:14   #14
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My point of view on sniping (myself NOT beign a sniper) is :

1.) to accept the frustration of having someone in your crosshairs and
a.) Fire and realise that your scope can reach the target, but not the BB.
b.) Fire and see your BB drift away because of wind.
2.) to accept revealing your position with the sound of your missed shot

3.) to accept facing a barrage of BBs seconds after.

That's what airsoft sniping is IMO.

From my experience, I find that spitting 30 BBs per second at 310-320 FPS has been FAR more effective than any sniping I've seen. Saturation is everything.

BTW Fox, 30 BBs per second (1800 RPM) is not an arbitrary number, that's the new ROF of the repaired Mr. Minimi, but hopefully, you're on my team for the next game
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Old May 30th, 2005, 12:19   #15
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Lol, good post! I'll have to agree totally with your view and points, except #2, as my M24 is pretty much silent outside earshot of 40ft or so. Other crappy point is that when sniping, you are pretty much prone, and that leaves a small target for the other guys to shoot at............ your FACE!!! Lol
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