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Old January 9th, 2011, 17:07   #1
Pyrohair
 
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D19-13-2 Clarification

Can anyone help me out interpreting this one? I have come by an excerpt from the D19-13-2 Document and I got to the part about Uncontrolled firearms. After giving it a good read over it seems to me like airsoft guns are not illegal? This doesnt make sense to me as you cant ship airsoft guns over the borders yet... So why is this so confusing?! Can anyone help me clarify what this means?

Excerpt:

“Uncontrolled” firearms
5. “Uncontrolled” firearms are those devices that, although falling within the definition of a firearm in the Criminal Code, are exempt from specific legal requirements of the Firearms Act and its regulations, as well as from other legislative provisions. “Uncontrolled” firearms do not fall under Tariff item No. 9898.00.00, and are generally admissible into Canada. “Uncontrolled” firearms should not be subdivided into any of the non-restricted, restricted, or prohibited classes. The following types of firearms are deemed “uncontrolled”:
(a) Antique firearms – The term “antique firearm” means:
(i) any firearm manufactured before 1898 that was not designed to discharge rim-fire or centre-fire ammunition and that has not been redesigned to discharge such ammunition; or
(ii) any firearm that is prescribed to be an antique firearm as listed in the Regulations Prescribing Antique Firearms.
Note: Reproductions of all types of antique handguns are considered “controlled” firearms unless the reproduction itself meets the definition of antique firearm (see above). If it is not possible to precisely determine whether a firearm is an antique firearm, consult the section entitled “controlled” firearms.
(b) Flare, blank, rivet and industrial guns – Any device that is designed exclusively for signalling, for notifying of distress, or for firing blank cartridges or for firing stud cartridges, explosive-driven rivets or other industrial projectiles, provided that the importer intends to use it only for the purpose for which it is designed.
(c) Slaughter, tranquilizing and line-throwing guns – Any device that is designed exclusively for the slaughtering of domestic animals, the tranquilizing of animals, or the discharging of projectiles with lines attached to them, provided that the importer intends to use it only for the purpose for which it is designed.
(d) Low muzzle velocity/energy guns – Any barrelled weapon that is not designed or adapted to discharge projectiles at a muzzle velocity exceeding 152.4 metres per second (500 feet per second) and at a muzzle energy exceeding 5.7 Joules, or to discharge projectiles that are designed or adapted to attain a velocity exceeding 152.4 metres per second (500 feet per second) and an energy exceeding 5.7 Joules. Both thresholds of 152.4 mps and 5.7 Joules must be exceeded for the firearm to be considered “controlled”. This requirement exempts firearms that fire below the threshold velocity with a standard projectile, but exceed the threshold velocity when fired with a high-velocity projectile.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 17:53   #2
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Welcome to the wonderful world or airsoft in canada. You are indeed correct airsoft guns aren't illegal. But that doesn't make them legal either. I do believe there is a thread stickies in the newbur tank that explains all this.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 17:56   #3
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Hmm.. I searched exactly D19-13-2 but It didnt come up with anything usefull. Ill have another look.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 17:57   #4
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Originally Posted by J-Man19 View Post
Welcome to the wonderful world or airsoft in canada. You are indeed correct airsoft guns aren't illegal. But that doesn't make them legal either. I do believe there is a thread stickies in the newbur tank that explains all this.
That thread was moved to the AV restricted section.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 18:05   #5
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Is there a way I can see the explanation for this documentation without being AV'd? I don't understand why I have to prove I'm over the age of 18 in order to see an explanation of a rule...
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Last edited by Pyrohair; January 9th, 2011 at 18:10..
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Old January 9th, 2011, 18:12   #6
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So I cant know about a Canadian law because I'm not AV'd?
Oh you can know about it, it is just the discussion proceeded to a point where is was decided that the information should not be discussed in the open. Regardless of Canadian law, we at this forum believe that you should be 18+ in order to aquire airsoft guns. As such there are measures in place on ASC to keep them out of the hands of people who are not proven to be adults.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 18:17   #7
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So there is no way I can acquire such knowledge without driving for an hour, waiting a week, and then checking back? All I am asking for is a bit of clarification on the differences between what this document says/means and what Airsoft guns are in the eyes of this document.

And just for the record, I'm not trying to be a pain or anything, I'd just love to know more about this topic.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 18:20   #8
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Originally Posted by Eeyore View Post
Oh you can know about it, it is just the discussion proceeded to a point where is was decided that the information should not be discussed in the open. Regardless of Canadian law, we at this forum believe that you should be 18+ in order to aquire airsoft guns. As such there are measures in place on ASC to keep them out of the hands of people who are not proven to be adults.
+1

This here is one of the single most concise explanation of how airsoft information in Canada works. Bravo, Eeyore.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 18:56   #9
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49. A prohibited device is:
(a) any component or part of a weapon, or any accessory for use with a weapon that is prescribed to be a prohibited device (e.g. any device designed for the purpose of discharging cartridges in rapid succession, bull-pup stocks, etc.);
(b) a handgun barrel that is equal to or less than 105 mm (approximately 4.1 inches) in length, but does not include any such handgun barrel that is prescribed where the handgun barrel is used in international sporting competitions governed by the rules of the International Shooting Union;
(c) a device or contrivance designed or intended to muffle or stop the sound or report of a firearm, such as silencers (please note that some silencers attached to airsoft guns may also be deemed prohibited devices if they can be used in real firearms);
(d) large-capacity cartridge magazines prescribed by regulation; or
(e) a replica firearm.

and:

54. The following are examples of devices that may be considered replica firearms (however, each device must always be assessed on a case-by-case basis and taking into account all the above-mentioned criteria):
(a) Toy guns and starter pistols do not generally qualify as firearms. However, some toy or model guns and starter pistols may be designed with very realistic mechanisms or appearances (e.g., colour, size, scale, translucency) and resembling a real make and model of a firearm. In such cases, they may be considered replica firearms even if they are made of plastic, die-cast zinc, or other material.
(b) Most airsoft guns and certain types of paintball guns or markers are considered replica firearms. This is because the muzzle velocity of the projectile does not generally cause serious bodily harm and their external features are clearly designed to resemble a specific and readily identifiable make and model of a firearm. The jurisprudence has established that to consider a firearm within the meaning of s. 2 of the Criminal Code, an airsoft gun must have a muzzle velocity in excess of 124 meters per second (407 feet per second). Therefore, due to their strong resemblance to real firearms and their lack of capacity to cause serious bodily injury, most airsoft guns (and some paintball guns) are generally considered replica firearms.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 22:56   #10
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Ahh. Thank-you Matt. But doesnt it seem a little backwards to anyone? In order for it to be ok it has to fire hot? Im even more confused now :P
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Old January 9th, 2011, 23:02   #11
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It's simple - no one understands it. It just is. But it's improving (s-l-o-w-l-y)
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Old January 9th, 2011, 23:08   #12
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Originally Posted by Pyrohair View Post
Ahh. Thank-you Matt. But doesnt it seem a little backwards to anyone? In order for it to be ok it has to fire hot? Im even more confused now :P
If it is harmless, it is prohibited. If it is dangerous, it is virtually unregulated. Think of our laws as being ass-backwards. If you think something logically might be one way, think the opposite and you have the correct answer.

If you have specific questions, ask them specifically and they will be answered. You are not going to "understand the law", experienced lawyers and judges don't.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 23:14   #13
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Well said. And there is also Prohibited Weapons Orders, which change with every legal decision and successful appeal going. And there is the officer's interpretaion vs the legal intention, and god help you if you say you didn't know it wasn't legal.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 23:15   #14
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Quote:
If it is harmless, it is prohibited. If it is dangerous, it is virtually unregulated. Think of our laws as being ass-backwards. If you think something logically might be one way, think the opposite and you have the correct answer.

If you have specific questions, ask them specifically and they will be answered. You are not going to "understand the law", experienced lawyers and judges don't.
Best answer I've ever heard to a legal question regarding Canada. Well done good sir.
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Old January 9th, 2011, 23:27   #15
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Dont worry dude, even some custom agents dont really know what it really means either.
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