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Old July 28th, 2010, 09:04   #1
XiNAVRO
 
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Few questions from a complete newbie.

Hello everyone.

Since I am not only new to the Airsoft Canada forums but new to airsoft itself as well, I thought it would be best to start by posting a few question first. Of course I have read the FAQs and searched the information center sections, but some of these questions are as ridiculous as they can be - and as of now I am uncertain if I will be participating in airsoft activities at all; these questions will let me decide for sure, so bear with me please. (Although I must admit that since using the forums is quite limited as a non-age verified member, might as well just pay a visit at Army Issue in about 3 hours and get it done right away - even if I don't end up playing airsoft, getting a nice pair of boots or cargo pants doesn't sound like a bad idea at all)


Legal issues: I have went through the entire thread Airsoft and Canadian Law but I must say, I am getting even more confused after reading it. I have got the impression that airsoft guns are classified as replica firearms on papers and the actual application of the Canadian law is more of a case-by-case matter. Seems like I can purchase an airsoft gun without a firearms license, however it needs to be concealed when carrying and using is only permitted in certain areas such as designated fields. Am I right so far?

Translucent gun body / full metal: Well, the orange tips aren't an issue in Canada; but what about the guns without a semi-transparent body? And to an extent, the full metal ones? I know that members here are carrying these - but is it legal?

Gear pricing: The retailer section is open for age verified only (although that should be not much of a problem after visiting Army Issue today) so I had to dig through some of the reviews and the gear retailer section to see where the gears and clothings are sold at. What came to my attention is that some of the websites are selling the (seemingly) same type of gear at vastly different prices. Take the modular chest rigs or modular vests for example - the pricing may go up twofold or threefold compared to US/Asian stores when they are of the same brand. I am not trying to criticize the stores, and I understand the reasoning behind guns being expensive due to customs and such; just wanted to know why the prices differ so much.


Thanks in advance!
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Old July 28th, 2010, 09:36   #2
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I'll take a stab at some of your questions.

1. It is legal to have (you do not need a PAL/RPAL)...not legal to transfer (in general). There are 1-2 sources that obtain them legally for resale...and those specific ones can be legally transfered to you the end user. It's at best a bit murky. I suppose technically if you do obtain a non-ancient one (Pre 199X something)...you're in possession of an illegally imported item and that may or may not mean something to you.

2. Opaque vs. Transparant (or some degree of tranparancy): "clear"/"semi-clear" items came about since a main point that classifies something as a replica is that it is not easily distinguishable from the real item. Obviously having the receiver transparant goes a long way in making that distinction (BTW...doesn't matter if it's blue/pick/camo/black/etc....it's either "transparant" or not). Legal? see point 1.

** General note **
The dummies guide to it is.....right or wrong/common sense or not, with few exceptions it's not legal to obtain/trade/transfer these things...and to do so is a decision you have to make.

One thing is absolute....it is NOT worth it to try to smuggle/import/order in from out of country these things yourself. Lost monies aside, the legal charges can be significant and long lasting. Every year there are guys who try...and fail.

3. BEWARE of some of the asian market gear. A $20 Delta Elite vest might seem to have all the MOLLE/features that you want...but when the stiching falls apart, the poppers rip out of the pouches and you find that the spacing of the MOLLE is all uneven you'll be left with $20 of scrap material. After spending lots of money on various gear over the years I'd sum it up with........set a budget, buy real stuff if you can afford it, buy Pantac if you can't. Quite honestly, much of the PANTAC stuff is just plain a good bang for your buck and will likely hold up to all the rough abuse that 95% of the players can dish out at it. Real stuff is nice though...

Hope that helps more than the inevitable "go get Age Verified" messages you'll get.
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Old July 28th, 2010, 11:09   #3
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Thanks for the insightful comment, m102404.

So it is as I suspected - it's not entirely illegal, but a good chunk of airsoft is in the shady grey area.
As long as it remains there I'll be happy to play along. (I'm in the field of accounting myself - that explains a lot, doesn't it?)
Well, time to stop by at Army Issue and meet Jeroon I guess.


PS. Well, like any other hobby, basically the more investment = the more you get. That was clear to begin with.
Just wanted to know why the price tag of the same product from the same company (i.e. PANTAC) differs so much.
Especially so when it's not about guns that involve a lot of loophole fiasco and luck, but protective / tactical gear.
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Old July 28th, 2010, 11:25   #4
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On the gear note, yes buying cheap china clone gear is a rip off for most people however I ONLY suggest it if you know some who can sew very well and has years under their belt with sewing! My entire family sews enough that they could take china gear and make it into pantac level of gear if they wanted too.

One reason why I love being asian

So if you fall into this category then your very fortunate. Otherwise look at Pantac, Blackhawk, 5.11, Condor and anything else Airsoft Retailers sell on their sites.

Last edited by Short Round; July 28th, 2010 at 11:27..
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Old July 28th, 2010, 12:14   #5
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So are you a programmer or something? I noticed your sig has a C++ like syntax for the coffee thing.

Anyway, airsoft is a great sport to get into. It may not be everyones cup of tea but try it out and see if you like it or not. I suggest renting for a day if you're not sure then depending on how it goes if you like it then invest $x into it but if you don't then it was only a rental anyways so you've only really lost: gas money, field fee, BB cost (~$15 for a bag of 2000), rental costs. Whereas some people who jump in and buy a gun right off the bat and find they don't enjoy it as much as they thought they would have a gun that usually depreciates very rapidly (clone guns like JG, G&G, Echo1, etc. tend to depreciate more rapidly than say VFC, G&P, or TM).

m102404 pretty much summed it up for you but just thought I might add that so you're not left out of more money if you decide that the sport isn't for you.
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Old July 28th, 2010, 12:19   #6
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stickied somewhere (newbie tank?) I wrote up a thing on navigating ASC and Newbie questions....might be worth the read if you're just starting out and figuring things out.
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Old July 28th, 2010, 13:10   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XiNAVRO View Post
Just wanted to know why the price tag of the same product from the same company (i.e. PANTAC) differs so much.
Different retailers can set whatever prices you wish. Sorta like why is Kraft Dinner 79 cents at Walmart and $1.49 at Sobeys? In some cases some retailers source direct from the manufacture and some retailers are only able to source through a distributor, so in that instance prices will reflect.

You stated you were in the accounting field. Which designation do you hold? CA? CGA? Or are you working towards a designation?
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Old July 28th, 2010, 14:47   #8
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Originally Posted by TokyoSeven View Post
Different retailers can set whatever prices you wish. Sorta like why is Kraft Dinner 79 cents at Walmart and $1.49 at Sobeys? In some cases some retailers source direct from the manufacture and some retailers are only able to source through a distributor, so in that instance prices will reflect.

You stated you were in the accounting field. Which designation do you hold? CA? CGA? Or are you working towards a designation?
I appreciate your comment TokyoSeven; but before stating out the obvious nature of retail business, take a look back at the original post that I have written. The gun prices in Canadian shops are much more expensive (and with a reason), and I was wondering if there is a specific reason why the tactical gear is expensive as well. Is it the small market size, is it the scarcity, or something else at work?

Working towards a designation right now btw. And yes, I do programming (occationally)
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Old July 28th, 2010, 14:50   #9
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small market size, limited direct-buying power.............and the HST, mostly the HST.

...and ECO fees...
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Old July 28th, 2010, 16:11   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m102404 View Post
small market size, limited direct-buying power.............and the HST, mostly the HST.

...and ECO fees...
eco fees are no longer a consumer paid thing.

Now the whole fucking province pays for it whether or not we buy shit or not. At least for the next 3 months.
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Old July 28th, 2010, 20:12   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XiNAVRO View Post
I appreciate your comment TokyoSeven; but before stating out the obvious nature of retail business, take a look back at the original post that I have written. The gun prices in Canadian shops are much more expensive (and with a reason), and I was wondering if there is a specific reason why the tactical gear is expensive as well. Is it the small market size, is it the scarcity, or something else at work?
Underpants gnomes.

But really, I wasnt aware that gear was that expensive or at least it doesnt seem expensive to me. Perspective I guess.
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Old July 28th, 2010, 20:50   #12
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Price points can be found here:
http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=93431
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