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WIP: Upgrading Your Tokyo Marui Glock

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Old November 20th, 2012, 12:40   #136
RacingManiac
 
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Lower/upper between G17 and G18 are not swappable. The sear/hammer/selector interaction is designed to work with their specific design...Although the springs are interchangeable...
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Old November 20th, 2012, 12:42   #137
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m1; I"m not adverse to that, one of the choices on the connect the dots list is a tinted frame.

I'm really liking that HK3P frame though. I might go the WE route too and see how they line up.

There are a ton of choices out there right now, I just can't find exactly what I want. Since it's winter I can stall a bit.

RM; good to know on the frames thanks.
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Old November 20th, 2012, 12:48   #138
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Originally Posted by Danke View Post
OK I pressed the button last week and have a G17 slide and barrel on the way. Now I need all the rest. TM will be the flavor.

What's the lowdown on G-17 vs. G18C? Can you drop a G17 slide on a G18 and have it run other than no more select fire? Could you take a G18 frame and do a complete strip and then drop in the full G17 lower pack?

I am thinking right now that it might be easiest to get 2-3 pistols and mix and match parts till I get what I want started. Then rebuild the stripped pistols, sell them off and carry on tuning the #1.
The Glock 18c and G17 are completely different in their hammer and BBU.

You can't mix and match them.

The hammer housing is different on the G18c because it has to house the full auto auto sear. It contains an extra pin to hold it into place. The hammer housing is also different and you wont be able to run the G17 hammer assembly without having a lot of problems.

The trigger bar for the both models is different. The G18c has a thickier trigger bar. You'll need to modify it to fit into a G17 hammer housing.

The BBH will not fit a G17 slide. The locking tabs are different on the G18c and will not be accommodated on a G17 slide. You COULD mount the G18c slide on a G17 lower but it will not function unless you heavily modify it to trip or not trip the full auto sear.

The rear sights are also different from one another. The G17 has a longer sight post than the G18c.

This is a complete list of of thernals you can interchange between the two:

The trigger
The front chassis
the safety tag
the hop unit
Inner barrel
bucking
front sight
slide lock
The frame
The two body pins
the rear locking screw for the hammer mech
The sear
the valve knocker
the sear spring
The recoil spring and spring guide
The slide catch
the magazine lock
The floating valve and spring.


You can't drop in the hammer housing, the bbh, and loading muzzle and the piston head, the hammer bearing, the hammer the trigger bar (but you can mod it to fit) the hammer springs....

I think that's all of it....
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Last edited by e-luder; November 20th, 2012 at 13:00..
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Old November 20th, 2012, 13:05   #139
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I forgot to mention:

If you plan on using some WE/HK3 internals, they are not 100% fit for the Marui Glock. Just be wary of that.

I did a comparison on both a couple pages back...
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Old November 20th, 2012, 13:31   #140
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Right now the plan is a nice slide and barrel. TM internals/TM G17 Custom body and then maybe that HK3P frame. Then dial in the accuracy and reliability.

Sights are still a question mark.

Pictures to follow when the parts start showing up.
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Old November 20th, 2012, 19:10   #141
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I still have not gotten my reaps bucking.

The performances on the glock have become even worse. Mostly due to the fall temperatures but the friction from the hammer assembly and the bbu is A LOT!!! Even with 5 o rings on the spring guide to compress the spring, there is so much friction.

I suspect the hammer notch or sear is worn down and therefore the bearing is sitting too high. I took it apart and what do you know, the hammer notch has some wear on it, I would say .1-.2mm of wear.

I also noticed that the hammer spring was sort of bent.



I just saw that gunsmodify released the version3 zero hammer, I think I am going to get it and try my luck.

The back of my bbh is starting to break, it already has a crack.
Would a aip bbh fit? Then I would get a nineball piston head and a aip nozzle.

My screws on my hop up unit are starting to strip, do you know where I can get a set? Also, my loading nozzle only comes fully into the nozzle and the slide only comes fully forward when the hop up unit is not fully tightened.

I will probably end up r hoping it.
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Old November 20th, 2012, 19:57   #142
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Quote:
The performances on the glock have become even worse. Mostly due to the fall temperatures but the friction from the hammer assembly and the bbu is A LOT!!! Even with 5 o rings on the spring guide to compress the spring, there is so much friction.
I don't quite understand what you are trying to achieve with your o-rings here. Are trying to short stroke your gun? The spring has nothing to do with the friction you are describing.
Quote:
I suspect the hammer notch or sear is worn down and therefore the bearing is sitting too high. I took it apart and what do you know, the hammer notch has some wear on it, I would say .1-.2mm of wear.

I also noticed that the hammer spring was sort of bent.
Your hammer should look like this: [click on the images for larger]
photo copy 5.JPGphoto copy 4.JPGphoto copy 6.JPG
I can't see how your hammer sits so I can't judge or give you suggestions on how it should be fixed...

as for you hammer spring, it shouldn't be over coiled like that. the middle portion should be in the same position as the other two coils.



Quote:
I just saw that gunsmodify released the version3 zero hammer, I think I am going to get it and try my luck.
I caution you using this. These hammers are particularly troublesome. They require large break-in times and sometimes cause more trouble than it suppose to fix.

Quote:
The back of my bbh is starting to break, it already has a crack.
Would a aip bbh fit? Then I would get a nineball piston head and a aip nozzle.
That BBH comes with it's proprietery piston head. You won't be able to use any other piston head than what it comes with unless it is heavily modified. Also that BBH is spec'd for a Marui loading muzzle. It is larger than the WE loading muzzle. So the integrated piston head may cause you problems...

Also the protrusion on the AIP BBH is much prouder than the stock WE BBH. If you are already having issues with that bearing, you may need to modify the AIP BBH.

have a look see:
WE on the left and AIP on the right:
photo copy 7.JPG

Quote:
My screws on my hop up unit are starting to strip, do you know where I can get a set? Also, my loading nozzle only comes fully into the nozzle and the slide only comes fully forward when the hop up unit is not fully tightened.
Then that means the rubber piece you put in there is pressing too much into the rubber causing that "jam".

THe screw can be had here: http://www.army-blood.com/en/goods.php?id=2524

I think there's ones in there judging from the pic...
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Old November 20th, 2012, 23:48   #143
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I bought a broken hfc glock 17 for 20 bucks on ebay a few weeks ago, and since its a clone of the tm 26 system, it wasnt much use until now. The frame and chassis are not compatible, but the hammer, sear, trigger bar, trigger, magazine catch, and hammer bearing are compatible.

I replaced the we hammer with the hfc hammer and bearing, kept the we spring, and put it back together. Turns out the hammer was sitting to high when cocked. You can visually see the hammer bearing is much lower, even though they are both 8mm.

I also sanded down the areas on the slide that are rounded for the outer barrel, to make the friction less.

This got rid of about 80% of all the friction that was there before. And without grease to.

I put the o rings on the spring guide so that the spring is a bit contracted. Without the o rings, the spring does not contract fully, so I assume this would add a bit of power to the spring, and more recoil. I originally did this because of the overwhelming amount of friction.

The guarder trigger bar is bent just a tad, not as bad as the we, but sometimes it still gets caught. How do you bend it back so the bbh does not get caught on it?

I took the trigger from the hfc and glued a piece of straw in the right are so that it is pushed back, like the gunsmodify trigger does. Once the glue dries Ill sand it down to the right area, so that the hammer can reset.

I got rid of the piece of plastic in the hop up. Turns out that when the nozzle isnt fully in the hop up chamber (slide isnt all the way forward), most of the air leaks and the hop up is noneffective. Now that there is much less friction, the slide fully comes forward. I will prorobly end up cutting a custom 6.03 modify barrel, doing an rhop, and using the bucking soley for air seal.


What bbh / piston head / nozzle setup do you recommend I get when mine breaks? I understand I need to replace all three at the same time since we is different.

Also, it says that the item is free on the website. Unfortunately my Chinese is very bad, as in I speak none.
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Old November 21st, 2012, 01:19   #144
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Quote:
This got rid of about 80% of all the friction that was there before. And without grease to.
well to be fair, you'll never be able to get a 100% frictionless slide on the Glock simply because the lower asembley needs to interact with the slide assembly. This is common to all airsoft pistols. But is more evident on the TM Glock because of its design.

Quote:
I put the o rings on the spring guide so that the spring is a bit contracted. Without the o rings, the spring does not contract fully, so I assume this would add a bit of power to the spring, and more recoil. I originally did this because of the overwhelming amount of friction.
That's the reverse logic. If you put buffers in, it will REDUCE the recoil that you feel. Also, short stroking your gun won't increase the stiffness of your recoil spring. It has no affect on powering or reducing the power of the spring itself.

As I stated before, the buffers will absorb the "blowback" (the force that's felt when the slide travels backwards). If you want a lot of kick in your gun, reduce the power of the recoil spring. This will make it easier for the gasses to push the slide backwards since there will be less resistance. The side effect is, you will have a sluggish slide return.

The common misconception is that a harder recoil spring gives more kick. To some extent yes. But most often times, it will actually reduce the kick. The recoil spring's primary function is to return the slide to battery where it is not compressed. It WANTS to uncompress not the other way around.

Quote:
The guarder trigger bar is bent just a tad, not as bad as the we, but sometimes it still gets caught. How do you bend it back so the bbh does not get caught on it?
It depends where it's bent. I don't understand how this would happen though. Isn't that trigger bar brand new? And it's made out of steel too. I can't see it bending that easily that fast. You should have years and years before it starts doing this. lol.

The bbh needs to interact with the trigger bar. Otherwise, the trigger can't return to ready fire position. Try adding some grease before you bend it.

But usually, the nub that's protruding from the hammer housing get caught on the BBH when the slide is returning to battery. There should be a slot somewhere on the FRONT where the loading muzzle's casing ends. It tends to get caught there.


Quote:

What bbh / piston head / nozzle setup do you recommend I get when mine breaks? I understand I need to replace all three at the same time since we is different.
I only tried out the BBH from AIP for the G17 and the Nineball Featherweight BBH for the G18c. I think those are the only two that make a separate BBH. Or you can buy a standard issue Marui BBH... They last just as long and you can add different types of piston head to it...

But I just tried the WE loading muzzle on my AIP set and it fits but it's very loose. The AIP integrated piston head is o-ringed. Which means, if there is a tight/loose fitting with the WE loading muzzle, you can buy 99 cent orings accordingly. But keep in mind, the loading muzzle will still be a bit loose within the BBH itself.

Quote:
Also, it says that the item is free on the website. Unfortunately my Chinese is very bad, as in I speak none.
What's free? I want one (whatever it is) if it's free.
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Old November 21st, 2012, 11:41   #145
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So far as I have noticed, adding o rings to compress the spring does have some effect. With the hop up unit fully tightened, the slide will not slide forward all the way, because the nozzle is getting stuck in the bucking. With 6 o rings on, the slide comes forward all the way (the nozzle comes fully into the bucking).

With the hop up unit a little loose though, the slide comes forward all the way, hence the nozzle slides easily into the bucking. I don't have the plastic anymore. When I get my reaps, Ill try modifying my bucking so that it is a bit thinner on the inside, so the nozzle can slide into it, but I will have to be aware of a possible air leak. I just ordered a chrono, xcortech btw.

My bbh has a little of up and down wiggle room. It seems like the sides have worn down. The screw for the rear sight gets loose after a few racks of the slide, and the bbh can move up and down. I added tape to both sides, and it fixed most of the up down movement, but the screw still gets loose.

Should the bbh have no movement and be tight in the slide?

On the website, it says that the kit costs 0.00. When I search anything up, it says the item cost is 0.00.

Buy standard issue marui bbh, you mean the one that comes with the marui 17? Where can I buy one? And what nozzle would you say to get? Along with the nineball piston head.

I also polished my slide catch and my recoil spring to a nice finish. Is the guarder metal slide catch made up of material / paint that can be stripped and polished? the metal looks different.

Also, my hfc "speed trigger" works, I glued a piece of straw to it and sanded it down so that there is just enough room for it to reset.

And yes, my trigger bar is brand spanking new.

Last edited by drewroud; November 21st, 2012 at 11:52..
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Old November 24th, 2012, 12:37   #146
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I need to give my G17 some TLC after lastnight's game. The trigger for whatever reason now refuses to reset correctly. It looks like the trigger bar return spring is over stretched. Where can I go about ordering some replacement? Also who makes longer firing pin for these? I seem to recall such product exist....

Thanks..
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Old November 24th, 2012, 14:58   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RacingManiac View Post
I need to give my G17 some TLC after lastnight's game. The trigger for whatever reason now refuses to reset correctly. It looks like the trigger bar return spring is over stretched. Where can I go about ordering some replacement? Also who makes longer firing pin for these? I seem to recall such product exist....

Thanks..
Replacement springs:
http://www.airsoftparts.ca/store2/in...oducts_id=2205

http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/upgrade-p...eries-gbb.html

http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/upgrade-p...i-g17-gbb.html

http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/upgrade-p...eries-gbb.html

http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/upgrade-p...eries-gbb.html
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Old November 24th, 2012, 17:34   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RacingManiac View Post
I need to give my G17 some TLC after lastnight's game. The trigger for whatever reason now refuses to reset correctly. It looks like the trigger bar return spring is over stretched. Where can I go about ordering some replacement? Also who makes longer firing pin for these? I seem to recall such product exist....

Thanks..
Hmmm. I don't remember there being an extended pin. Having a it would surely cause constant pressure on the blowoff valve which could result in the valve being always open, even if it's slightly.

I have a few of those springs if you want one RM. FOR FREE!!!!!

Also, if you're still looking for an alternate extended slide catch, Freedom Arts makes one for the G26. It's not as prominent as the AS one though...
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Old November 24th, 2012, 17:57   #149
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Quote:
So far as I have noticed, adding o rings to compress the spring does have some effect. With the hop up unit fully tightened, the slide will not slide forward all the way, because the nozzle is getting stuck in the bucking. With 6 o rings on, the slide comes forward all the way (the nozzle comes fully into the bucking).
That's because the spring is stil applying "springing out" even when the slide is at rest. Your O-rings are not increasing the power of your spring, it's just causing the spring to be coiled constantly. Thus, "forcing" the muzzle into the bucking even when the slide is in battery.

Quote:
With the hop up unit a little loose though, the slide comes forward all the way, hence the nozzle slides easily into the bucking. I don't have the plastic anymore. When I get my reaps, Ill try modifying my bucking so that it is a bit thinner on the inside, so the nozzle can slide into it, but I will have to be aware of a possible air leak. I just ordered a chrono, xcortech btw.
See, my concern with your modifications is that, it's not a necessary modification to begin with. Modifiying the bucking, I fear that you may overdo it and ruin the bucking altogether. In essence, the bucking needs to be tight around the BB to create a perfect seal. If you sand it down, you'll increase the chance of the bucking's inability to seal properly.

The fix to your issue is usually a stronger return spring and properly tucking in the bucking into the hop-up unit.

Quote:
Should the bbh have no movement and be tight in the slide?
There should be no wiggling around. IT should sit tight.

Quote:
Buy standard issue marui bbh, you mean the one that comes with the marui 17? Where can I buy one? And what nozzle would you say to get? Along with the nineball piston head.
I tend to use the Guarder ones but I stopped using them because they kept breaking on my gun at higher pressures. My Gun shoots at an FPS range between 370-385FPS and it obliterates the Guarder muzzle.

You can buy the Airsoft Surgeon kit. It comes with it's own piston head that's not half as bad as the other aftermarket piston head. It's a pretty good combo.

Or the Shooter's Design Kit. Those are the only three you should consider. Everything else is just crap...

Quote:
Buy standard issue marui bbh, you mean the one that comes with the marui 17? Where can I buy one?
yes.
I will messege you the link.

Quote:
I also polished my slide catch and my recoil spring to a nice finish. Is the guarder metal slide catch made up of material / paint that can be stripped and polished? the metal looks different.
That catch is made out of steel. Yes you can strip the paint but polish it right after to prevent it from oxidizing.
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Old November 26th, 2012, 16:04   #150
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It has begun.
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